Popular

My niece is 13 and navigating the dangerous waters of Junior High. We spoke for SO long last night. She is really beautiful and very smart - but she is obsessed with being in with a certain crowd and it makes me feel so bad to see her getting anxious over the approval of a bunch of pimply faced imbeciles.

And as I was talking to FH and telling him how sad it all is and how glad I am that I am not in school anymore, he laughed. He told me that it doesn't end in high school. That people continue to crave acceptance forever.

And he is right! I mean - in school I was a weird little art freak. I thought I was indifferent to popularity - but I would have been crushed if I thought anyone actively disliked me. And even now - I might not court acceptance - but sometimes I get a little worried that the other class moms might look down on me because I am not a SAHM. Or sometimes I get worried that my hair won't pass muster at a board meeting. It is COMPLETELY against my nature to worry about what other people think of me. But I do.

And I worry about passing that 'fretting' on to my sons. I don't want them to feel like they have to be something particular or that they have to fit in to be worthwhile.

Do you ever REALLY desire the acceptance of someone else, even when you know it doesn't ultimately matter whether they love you or despise you?

At least you have sons - its worse with girls - I have 2 stepdaughters in Plainview who ARE popular - and thank goodness, because the ones who are not are brutalized.

Plus, I work with the kids with autism - the high functioning kids in middle school and high school -whether boy or girl - go thru hell....

I went to a very small private middle school and high school - there were definitely the popular kids (like, Donna Karan's daughter and Lizzie Grubman - we had the Paris Hiltons with us everyday - joy of joys ) but for the unceleb students, we were all artsy and kooky, so we all had a niche to fall into somewhere - I look at these big high schools in LI, and I'm like - how the hell would I have survived??

Your FH is right - it never goes away - these cliques continue with mothers... and even internet chat forums - come on - don't you even see it on here and LIF? Its everywhere...

That is why - and this sounds sooooo cheesy and self helpish I want to shoot myself b/c I hate self help books, but - you have to really build yourself from the inside. Have a strong foundation. If you look to other people to validate you, then your life is one big roller coaster. I rock with the people who think I'm cool, but I am a loser to those who think I'm stupid or a bottom feeder - my identity would change from moment to moment, group to group. And I have a feeling those SAHMs with the perfect hair, starved bodies, and perfect little outfits live for people to look up to them, and if someone does not, they are devastated... not to over generalize, but I see it too everywhere....

Your husband is a smart man.

Once you think that way, that that popularity contest doesn't end in high school, you see it all over. My parents have a cottage in a summer community and it's amazing how similar it is to high school. Who's doing what to their house, who's son or daughter did this or that, who bought a new boat or new car... And probably 50% of these people or more are retirees! It never ends.

My niece is 13 too, and also concerned about fitting in. She's a cheerleader, has the trendy clothes & hairstyle, etc. But when I talk to her, really talk to her, I know she's in there somewhere. I just hope it doesn't take her too long to figure out who she is, what she wants, and that life isn't about making other people like you. That having two personas - the real you, and then the one you show people you're trying to impress - is exhausting and not worth the effort.

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Do you ever REALLY desire the acceptance of someone else, even when you know it doesn't ultimately matter whether they love you or despise you?

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It depends on the person - I take it from where it comes. Some people's opinions mean nothing to me because of who they are. Some people's opinions mean a hell of a lot to me because I love and respect them.

But I can be pretty picky about my 'real life' close friends and the ones I trust with all my secrets and personal details. These people have a lot of integrity, and are hard to find. Thus, that is a very short list but one I put all my love and loyalty into.

I was both very popular and very unpopular throughout my life.

in elementary, it was easy. you just had friends. some of my friends parents had money, so they had cool clothes like Levis jeans. my wardrobe consisted of cords...of every conceivable color (except normals ones, like black or tan) b/c they were $5.99 each at a store on 5th ave. I was smart and a tomboy, which worked to my advantage. I wasn't that comfy around girls, but boys were an OASIS for me. I could fight, run, play ball, so I was cool, even if I was a 'girl'

over the summer bet. elem and JHS....I 'developed'. It could not have been a bigger disaster for me. now, I was OBVIOUSLY very much a girl...and boys couldn't overlook my boobs. I took to wearing huge shirts to cover up. and, even though I had put on weight, I looked even bigger. so now, I was 'fat' according to girls...and a GIRL according to boys. suffice it to say, 7th & 8th grade sucked. I had friends, but I was in a special program with all the rich cool Park Slope kids...and I definitely didn't fit in. One day towards the end of 8th grade, I had nothing to wear. I was forced to wear one of my sisters shirts and a pair of capris. the shirt 'fit' (meaning it wasn't huge) and every 8th grade boy in the school finally realized I wasn't that I was hugely fat (maybe chubby) but I had HUGE knockers. LOL. it was kind of liberating...leading me to high school....

where I was INSANELY popular. I don't really know why. I went to a school in the city for creative writing, and no one really knew me. I had come to grips with the whole puberty thing, and had changed a lot over the summer, for better and for worse....but I kind of had an 'I don't give a fuk' attitude, and perhaps for that reason, everyone was all about ME. the flip of that though, is that I befriended anyone that was nice, funny, smart, jock. I didn't care. I had no prescription for who a friend could be....and I made some great ones. so, I was popular in the sense that EVERYONE liked me (or secretly hated me HA HA) but I didn't necessarily 'belong' to one click...I was friends with them all, and floated seemlessly form one group to the next, taking what I wanted and leaving the rest.

thankfully I carried that on to adult life. I learned a lot about 'who' I am (and quite honestly, how contradictory some facets of my personality can be) and though it's sometimes hard for me, or people who 'know' me to keep up or keep track, not pidgeon-holing myself into a particular 'person' and expressing myself in different ways has helped me 1) keep my sanity and 2) meet and befriend such a wide spectrum of people that I feel truly blessed.

I am a bit of a weirdo. maybe a self-actualized schizophrenic LOL, but at least I know that..and I am very forward about WHO I am, like it or not. I find that most people respect that, and sometimes I even grow on you. I guess it depends on which version of 'me' you meet first...the good, the bad...or the ugly.

so wow, this was long, but you caught me at a chatty moment...but the point is....it's a terrible feeling to not be 'accepted' by people, but i think it also has to do with where you came from. my childhood experience at home shaped my desire (or lack of it) for acceptance I think more than my JHS years. I only want it from people I love. peripheral people in my life can take me or leave me, and I honestly and truly do not care either way. but if I LOVE...oh God...it's truly terrible for me...b/c giving my love and having it not be 'good enough' or not accepted by someone...the idea of it just KILLS me. it makes me want to run and hide. but, the alternative, is to not care about anything at all...and I just don't think I was built that way....

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Posted by JessicaM.

JE-ZUS. that was even longer than I thought.

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Now I am dying to meet you.

I love your thoughts. i felt like I got into your brain for a moment and I must say I feel honored.

I'm not sure if we are similar people or I just want us to be similar. I often have difficulty putting my feelings down into words that make sense.

God - being popular. I've been putting off responding to this post all day so that I would have time to really say what I wanted knowing that probably no one would really read it....

Who cares!

Elementary school was an odd experience for me Pre-school through 4th grade were different schools every year. Pre-school - somewhere in Florida, kindergarten- private catholic school in Bellrose, Queens, 1st grade - Raleigh, North Carolina, 2nd grade back to catholic school in Bellrose, Queens, 3rd grade PS 132? in Bellrose, Queens and by 4th grade we have finally moved out to Smithtown, Long Island.

here I am, this city kid with a best friend that is Turkish a crush BIG TIME on a Puerto Rican kid and friends of all different colors and we move to lily white smithtown. I will never forget my two years in that hell hole of an elementary school. I was never accepted. It hurt and I didn;t understand. The kids made fun of the clothes I wore because NOTHING I owned was designer. God I can still see some of their smirking faces!

Middle school got better. although 6th grade was TERRIBLE - 7th and 8th were not nearly as bad. I grew these HUGE boobies and had to wear a bra - I was NOT happy. Finally got a group of friends in 7th grade - that was the best year ever! I wasn't popular - we just had our own little crowd of 5 or 6. it was nice to be included for once!

HIgh school was ok. I became friends with an older crowd. When they graduated at the end of my sophomore year I was mostly alone. I had my best friend Janae. We had a few other friends on and off but nothing stuck - just us...

College was crazy - I actually did become quite popular by the time I was a senior. I hated it. People that I didn;t know knew me and wanted to know me. It was weird. My sorority kinda disowned me. I left with very few friends by the time graduation came around. It was very sad. Student teaching in ALbany really screwed it all up for me. All my friendships fell apart.

I have been hurt countless times by my 'friends' Even today the bullshiit continues.

I have my wonderful family, my fh, my two sisters and Janae - who I know, no matter what, will always be there for me. It's hard to know who is for real and who is not. I have learned the hard way that no matter how much you love someone that does not mean they will love you back. Very painful.

I'm a very needy person and only have become more so as I have gotten older. Just insecurity. I hope to work on it so that it improves. I am ALWAYS looking for acceptance. Always. It suckss.

I have been popular and I guess, not necessarily unpopular, just not on the map.

When I was popular (in college) - it was actually difficult to deal with after so many years of really just not being on anyone's radar. But maybe that's because I was more popular with boys and it affected potential female friendships.

Now - I don't care. Like reaaaaaaaaaaaally just don't care. I'm truly at a point where I sort of wait for people to come around to me.

I'm actually thinking about this as I prepare to start a new job in the summer - I will be immersed to a possibly huge company where I'll deal with the cliques and possible junior high attitude being the 'new kid'. But I'm not concerned.

I have always been extremely quiet and introverted, and in Junior High this makes you a target. I was ridiculed beyond belief in 7th/8th grade. It lead to self loathing and negative behaviors of course. By 9th grade, most of the bullies had been kicked out of school (they did more than bully other girls) - and while never popular, I made it through a peaceful HS existence.

I still have a whole bunch of that ridiculed Junior High girl inside of me who wants approval and everyone to like me and think I am pretty and smart. Is it irrational to think everyone could like me? Yes. But what ya gonna do?

ETA: Every time I read the subject line of this post I start singing 'Popular' by Nada Surf. Anyone else remember that video?

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Posted by SuzBride

ETA: Every time I read the subject line of this post I start singing 'Popular' by Nada Surf. Anyone else remember that video?

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I almost posted the link to it.

For the most part, I was never really 'popular' although I was friends with all the popular kids in high school... but I wasn't unpopular either b/c I went to all the parties and hung out with everyone that was considered popular. I guess I was just in my own little world...

I am still friends with many of the people that I went to HS, JHS and Elementary school with -- maybe not close friends but friends, nonetheless...

In high school, like most people, i was overly concerned with being cool - which inevitably made me uncool in retrospect - I was a quintessential loser --- trying desperately to fit in but still be different... but to a fault.

I also went thru a terrible time my junior and senior year of high school where I had a complete falling out with most of my friends and was left with literally 1 friend... I made up with many of those people in time b/c we all realized the ridiculousness of the situation... but I'll never forget that shut-out feeling... not being accepted and not having a friend to talk to made school miserable -- I considered dropping out (although I was an honor student) and had no desire to go to college (I was forced to apply by my parents and guidance counselor -- thank god for her -- I got a scholarship to go to college and subsequently went on for my masters).

But I also think about all those Popular kids from high school and so many of them didn't turn out that well ... drug problems, dead end jobs, etc... so popularity, or lack thereof, is really what you make and what's more important are your values and not losing sight of what's truly important to you... too bad no one realizes this at 13, life would be much easier!

elementary school--shy and not popular at all
JHS---totally came out of my shell and I would even call myself a big mouth. Had a ton of friends, not necessarily the 'in crowd' but I was happy.
HS---was a little bit tired of the small town i grew up in (on LI but a smaller school district). had a lot of friends in all crowds but was looking forward to moving on and wanted more close friends. the popular crowd had some people i thought were great and some that i thought were totally empty. i truly believe that i had less concern for the popularity thing than most people in my school. the truly cool popular kids seemed to like me just fine and they knew that i was not a social climber.
college--life was good. i do not think that there was a popular crowd but i knew a lot of people and i was comfortable wherever i went.
law school--had a ton of cliques but they were all pretty nerdy.
later on--i see where the popularity thing is STILL an issue and I am pushing 40. on fire island, where i spend my summers, some people kiss up to the few people that they think are cool. honestly, i believe that those people that everyone else kisses up to like me enough, so i am just normal with them. i have one friend who enjoys making sure that everyone knows him and that he meets people wherever he goes. it gets to be a bit much but he's not a jerk about it. i have another friend who is more of a jerk about it. she has talked about me behind my back, just so she can show people that she is 'in the know' about my life. sometimes i wonder, if she met someone who said that they do not like me, would she agree just to sound cool?
the future--when I have kids, they better not have parents with attitudes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i was never popular but i always had friends - actually i always had the SAME friends. . . i picked 4 girls and they have been my friends basically since kindergarten.

I was always a loser, always smart and i am VERY awkward in my own skin. I hide it well now but in certain social situations it becomes glaringly obvious ( i turn white, kind of hunch over, stutter and just look painfully awkward)

i care what every single person thinks about me, the lady behind me at church - the guy next to me at a stoplight, some random coworker - i think about what each and every person thinks of me. . .and usually i make up entire stories of how they know what a gigantic loser i am

wow this makes me sound sad - but im not it is just part of my day

Normal person drops something - picks it up and moves on.

Me? I drop something - picture everyone thinking I am a loser for dropping it and then obsess about what a loser I am for the rest of the day.

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Posted by stephanielyse

I don't think you're a loser, I think you're awesome!

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thanks! i feel pretty hardcore when i am online - mostly bc of the option of deleting stupid posts!!

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. I care more about the impression I leave on people I rarely see or people I think are 'cooler than me,' whatever that means

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isn't it crazy that there are still 'cool' people - and to think, i couldnt wait to get out of HS!

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Posted by ant n tilde
i care what every single person thinks about me, the lady behind me at church - the guy next to me at a stoplight, some random coworker - i think about what each and every person thinks of me. . .and usually i make up entire stories of how they know what a gigantic loser i am

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I am sooo suprised to read this from you! You are so beautiful and opinionated and I just think you are spectacular. I imagine you being one of the cool as a cucumber folks who doesn't give a rats azz what anyone thinks of her because you KNOW how awesome you are.

Well... even if you don't know it.. you are STILL pretty awesome!

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Posted by rojerono

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Posted by ant n tilde
i care what every single person thinks about me, the lady behind me at church - the guy next to me at a stoplight, some random coworker - i think about what each and every person thinks of me. . .and usually i make up entire stories of how they know what a gigantic loser i am

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I am sooo suprised to read this from you! You are so beautiful and opinionated and I just think you are spectacular. I imagine you being one of the cool as a cucumber folks who doesn't give a rats azz what anyone thinks of her because you KNOW how awesome you are.

Well... even if you don't know it.. you are STILL pretty awesome!

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I think growing up with a mother with mental illness helped toughen my skin a lot... I think I would care how other people perceived me if I didnt grow up everyday with someone constantly beating me down and berating me - well - I guess that can take a person in either direction, really, but for me, since I already survived the worst, nothing could ever compare to what I grew up with. I think I feel that no one can ever hurt me with their thoughts or with the way they perceive me.

I do care how I'm perceived at work though, because that affects me professionally and thats very important to me....

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Posted by rojerono

I am sooo suprised to read this from you! You are so beautiful and opinionated and I just think you are spectacular. I imagine you being one of the cool as a cucumber folks who doesn't give a rats azz what anyone thinks of her because you KNOW how awesome you are.

Well... even if you don't know it.. you are STILL pretty awesome!

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wow thank you - i really respect your opinion and i feel pretty awesome right now!

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Posted by lipglossjunky73


I think growing up with a mother with mental illness helped toughen my skin a lot... I think I would care how other people perceived me if I didnt grow up everyday with someone constantly beating me down and berating me - well - I guess that can take a person in either direction, really, but for me, since I already survived the worst, nothing could ever compare to what I grew up with. I think I feel that no one can ever hurt me with their thoughts or with the way they perceive me.

I do care how I'm perceived at work though, because that affects me professionally and thats very important to me....

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first of all, i am sorry that you had to deal with that but i am so glad that you turned it around and used such a terrible experience to become such a great person