Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Original post by AndreaES

Nov 30, 2005 12:16 AM

I sincerely think that America is PC crazy!!!! I mean come on, some of these complaints are just friggen ridiculous. Over the last several decades we've morphed into a nation of over sensitive whinners.It's truly appalling, and to be honest if it wasn't so pathetic it would be laughable. But it is pathetic. We act like a bunch of spoiled children running to our parents when the bully at school says something mean. Except it not our parents it's our government we run crying to. We are one of the most privileged and spoon feed societies in the world. We don't have millions upon millions starving to death, dying of simple diseases that could be cured easily with antibiotics, we're not suffering through drought, genocide, ethnic cleansing,a cruel dictatorship no we are not!!! Actually we waste over 7 million pounds of food a year, and we don't die from TB we get inoculated, as of yet we have plenty of water, and we haven't seen genocide close up (at home) for hundreds of years. But do we appreciate any of that, sadly for the most part NO!!!! We fane empathy and act concerned but we still whine and complain like the spoiled children we have become at every little inconvenience or hurtful word. Do we truly comprehend the millions and millions suffering in ways we can't even imagine right at this very moment NO!!!! What are our HUGE concerns, that someone called you black, in stead of African American, or someone at work called you a girl instead of a woman, or that the city officals in NYC have the nerve to put up at tree at CHRISTMAS time and call it a CHRISTMAS TREE!!!!!!!!!! I mean come on people, that's just plain stupidity. We all need a good kick in the a$$ to wake us up. And we have to stop alerting the authorities everytime we have hurt feelings and deal with things ourselves. Our founding fathers would be turning over in their graves if they could see what we've become. A bunch of bumbling idiots. We are Americans dammit, we're strong, independent, intelligent, resourceful,and one of the most power people of the world, so let's start acting like it again. America is a free country, but our freedoms are slipping away, how can we have free speech when the government tells us what we can or can't say??? We are chipping away at our own freedoms,why?? Because someone said something or has something we didn't like?? We are digging our own graves. So what do you say we pull our heads out of our collective a$$es and let them put up the FUC$ING Christmas tree!!!

Thanks for letting me get that out. Feel free to flame me, and I promise I won't tell on you!!!!

Sincerely, Andrea

soontobemrsv Posted: Dec 05, 2005 07:35 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

wow.....all i have to say to well said Andrea!!!!!

edited.. was in caps..lol

FallBride05 Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:00 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by Goldi1021

Posted by PrincessRose

Posted by LaurenluvsTJ

Well, first I must say, yes, I too am fed up with the PCness of the country.
BUT
as a person who does not celebrate christmas, I can tell you first hand, that especially as a little kid, you feel really left out at this time of year; everwhere you look, there are CHRISTMAS decorations and everyplace is playing CHRISTMAS music, and everyone wishes you a merry CHRISTMAS.
Maybe calling the Rockefeller tree a hoilday tree isn't such a terrible idea. It would make a lot more people feel included and maybe spare the hurt feelings of some children (and adults). Many Jewish families get trees and call it a Chanukah bush so that their children do not feel left out. I have to say, when watching the Thanksgiving parade this year, I thought the same thing I do every year - why do they end the parade with Santa Claus? I do not celebrate Chrismas.
Why is Christmas a national holiday, but not any holiday of any other religion? If I want to take a day off to observe a holiday in my religion, I have to take a personal or vacation day.
I do think this counry needs to wake up a little and come to the realization that not every citizen is of a Christian faith.
I don't know if I strayed away from the original topic here, but I too felt the urge to vent.

HAPPY HOLIDAYS, EVERYONE!

Lauren, you're not alone. When I was a little kid, I thought I was a bad child because my teacher told my class that 'Santa Claus comes to the houses of all good little boys and girls.' From there, I managed to infer that all Jewish people were bad, because Santa doesn't go to their houses. What were my parents gonna tell me? That there was no Santa and it was a story that Christian parents told their children? Right, so I could tell all the other 3 year olds that there is no Santa. Brilliant.

Listen, no one here disagrees that the tree in Rockafeller Center is a CHRISTMAS Tree, but it truly can be very difficult this time of year, especially in other parts of the country where you *are* the only non-christian in the class.

I am sorry but I never grew up feeling this way. My parents simply told me that people believed different things. I never felt left out. I never felt that I was bad for being Jewish and I certainly was not offended by the overwhelming presence of Christmas. I never brought a tree into my home as my family would not allow it. It simply does not represent ANYTHING my family believes in. My father sold Chrsitmas decorations in his store and we could have had a KILLER tree but it never passed the front door. I will NEVER bring a tree in my home or anything that resembles one. FH and I both feel that we have to be strong and supportive of the faith we choose to instill in our children. If they have questions, we will answer them. even if they decide at a later time in their lives that they would prefer another religion, then fine by us as long as their decisions are well thought and researched.

Do I celebrate and share non-Jewish holidays with member of my family or friends who arent Jewish? DEFINITELY. I LOVE learning about other cultures and religions for the sake of knowledge. But rather than make my future children feel bad or placating them for not having Santa Claus, I prefer to surround them with the knowledge of their own faith than bring something into our home that we don't believe in. It can be done. It worked for me.

As I said in another post on this board, the reason why Jewish holidays are not national holidays (or international holidays for that matter) is because despite the presence of Jews in this country, NY State and the city, we comprise less than 1% of all religions in the world. To shut down government offices and big business for that small percentage simply isnt practical. LI and NYC close their schools not for the students but moreso for their teachers.

And again, let this post not mask my opinion that a Christmas tree is a Christmas tree and a menorah is a menorah. Call it what it is and enough already.

Leslie - You took the words right out of my mouth...

I never felt left out growing up because I did not celebrate Christmas. Many of my Jewish friends would bring a Hannukah bush into their home or decorate with blue xmas lights. To each his own.. but I was and am proud of my beliefs and the traditions of my faith.

My friends who had never been to a jewish wedding before, are still talking about the beautiful traditions we brought into the ceremony (like the bedekin (or vieling) for one). Or me circling my DH 7 times. They said they'd never seen anything so beautiful.

I'm proud of who I am..

But I agree... a Christmas tree is just that, a Christmas tree, and a Menorah is a Menorah.. period.

PrincessRose Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:14 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Just to clarify a few points -

I was three when I came up with my brilliant theory about being a bad person because Santa didn't come. It was because my teacher told our class that Santa comes to the houses of 'All good little boys and girls'. What other logical conclusion is a three year old going to come up with from that?

I grew up in Connecticut, in a little town with no sidewalks or other Jews. Not New York. People in NY, both Jewish and not, forget that once you leave NY (or even once you get too far upstate), Jews are more of a rarity. Even though growing up I *was* proud of who I am and my heritage, it's still difficult to be the Only different kid. Even now in Delaware I have to put up with a lot of BS for being Jewish, and not just because it's Christmas. Yeah, believe it.

IMO, people who fight the fight for things like calling Christmas Trees Holiday Trees, or want to make the story of Snow White into Snow White and the 7 Vertically Challenged Individuals, do more harm than help for their cause. I think it brings out this side of people, and rightfully so, that actually causes *more* intolerance of those different. It's a Christmas Tree, no sensible person is going to disagree with that. But to then turn it around and fight against cultural sensitivity as a whole concerns me.

I have no problem with Christmas, okay? There is no War on Christmas. But there are people boycotting stores for suggesting their associates wish people Happy Holidays. Why? Because obviously, everyone celebrates Christmas, and those who don't are heathens anyway and should just suck it up and deal?

FallBride05 Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:29 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

I grew up in Connecticut, in a little town with no sidewalks or other Jews. Not New York. People in NY, both Jewish and not, forget that once you leave NY (or even once you get too far upstate), Jews are more of a rarity. Even though growing up I *was* proud of who I am and my heritage, it's still difficult to be the Only different kid. Even now in Delaware I have to put up with a lot of BS for being Jewish, and not just because it's Christmas. Yeah, believe it.

-----------------------------------------------------

Where in CT? We lived in a little nothing town in CT until I was 14. We were the only Jewish family. Schools were not closed on Rosh Hashanna or Yom Kippur. My parents had to drive me 35 miles for Hebrew school and Sunday school. I understand far to well what you are saying.

PrincessRose Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:37 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by FallBride05
Where in CT? We lived in a little nothing town in CT until I was 14. We were the only Jewish family. Schools were not closed on Rosh Hashanna or Yom Kippur. My parents had to drive me 35 miles for Hebrew school and Sunday school. I understand far to well what you are saying.

New Fairfield. It's a little town just north of Danbury.

FallBride05 Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:39 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by PrincessRose

Posted by FallBride05
Where in CT? We lived in a little nothing town in CT until I was 14. We were the only Jewish family. Schools were not closed on Rosh Hashanna or Yom Kippur. My parents had to drive me 35 miles for Hebrew school and Sunday school. I understand far to well what you are saying.

New Fairfield. It's a little town just north of Danbury.

I know where that is.. We lived East of Hartford, not far from the Mass Pike.

ShortBride Posted: Dec 06, 2005 10:10 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by PrincessRose

, or want to make the story of Snow White into Snow White and the 7 Vertically Challenged Individuals, do more harm than help for their cause. I

there's actually a funny book called 'politically correct bedtime stories' with stories like that

Even though I grew up on LI, there were very few Jewish kids in my school. I definatly had some minor problems, nothing major. I don't think any of those problems would have been alleviated by calling a Christmas tree a holiday tree
When I told DH about the controversy, his reaction was: who has the time to think about this?????

Jax430 Posted: Dec 06, 2005 06:32 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

I think the whole 'holiday tree' thing is absolutely ridiculous. If it wasn't Christmas, there would be no tree - period! It doesn't symbolize Chanukah, Kwaanza, or any other holiday. Just because multiple holidays happen to fall out at the same time of year doesn't mean that we have to change the meanings of our symbols. I would incredibly offended if someone asked me to call my chanukah menorah 'holiday candlesticks'!

Rachel, I definitely agree with you that I prefer when people say 'Happy Holidays' instead of 'Merry Christmas,' at least in the NY area where there are many Jews as well as others who do not celebrate Christmas. When I was a little kid, we were in a restaurant in the Carolinas somewhere and the waitress asked me, 'Honey, what is Santa going to bring you all for Christmas?' My mom tells me that I looked at the woman like she was an idiot and said, 'I don't celebrate Christmas!'

Goldi1021 Posted: Dec 06, 2005 09:15 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by Jax430

I think the whole 'holiday tree' thing is absolutely ridiculous. If it wasn't Christmas, there would be no tree - period! It doesn't symbolize Chanukah, Kwaanza, or any other holiday. Just because multiple holidays happen to fall out at the same time of year doesn't mean that we have to change the meanings of our symbols. I would incredibly offended if someone asked me to call my chanukah menorah 'holiday candlesticks'!

Rachel, I definitely agree with you that I prefer when people say 'Happy Holidays' instead of 'Merry Christmas,' at least in the NY area where there are many Jews as well as others who do not celebrate Christmas. When I was a little kid, we were in a restaurant in the Carolinas somewhere and the waitress asked me, 'Honey, what is Santa going to bring you all for Christmas?' My mom tells me that I looked at the woman like she was an idiot and said, 'I don't celebrate Christmas!'

JAX you may have gone NUTS seeing the gingerbread Chanukah house in Waldbaums like I did. When did Chanukah houses coem about? I was at a loss. I had to question whether this was to have Jewish people assimilate and blend in - even be more accepted - OR to make the Jewish kids 'feel better' about not having tasty treats at holiday time. I dont know about you but I was always satisfied with potato latkes and chocolate gelt. I didnt need to be like everyone else.

Jax430 Posted: Dec 07, 2005 10:42 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by Goldi1021

Posted by Jax430

I think the whole 'holiday tree' thing is absolutely ridiculous. If it wasn't Christmas, there would be no tree - period! It doesn't symbolize Chanukah, Kwaanza, or any other holiday. Just because multiple holidays happen to fall out at the same time of year doesn't mean that we have to change the meanings of our symbols. I would incredibly offended if someone asked me to call my chanukah menorah 'holiday candlesticks'!

Rachel, I definitely agree with you that I prefer when people say 'Happy Holidays' instead of 'Merry Christmas,' at least in the NY area where there are many Jews as well as others who do not celebrate Christmas. When I was a little kid, we were in a restaurant in the Carolinas somewhere and the waitress asked me, 'Honey, what is Santa going to bring you all for Christmas?' My mom tells me that I looked at the woman like she was an idiot and said, 'I don't celebrate Christmas!'

JAX you may have gone NUTS seeing the gingerbread Chanukah house in Waldbaums like I did. When did Chanukah houses coem about? I was at a loss. I had to question whether this was to have Jewish people assimilate and blend in - even be more accepted - OR to make the Jewish kids 'feel better' about not having tasty treats at holiday time. I dont know about you but I was always satisfied with potato latkes and chocolate gelt. I didnt need to be like everyone else.

Same here - I had my holiday, my classmates had theirs, and that was it. No Chanukah bushes or stockings for me. I think I once asked my mom about a Chanukah stocking b/c my friend had one and she got annoyed at me! Was the Chanukah house at least kosher?

FallBride05 Posted: Dec 07, 2005 10:47 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

marymoon Posted: Dec 07, 2005 11:42 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

LOL. How funny would it be if the chanuhkah house were NOT kosher?

I don't care either way. My mom, for some reason, bles her heart, gets pissed when it's 'Happy Holidays' and not 'merry chirstmas'. Th rockefeller center tree? I don't care. Clearly it's a Christmas tree. You can call it whatever you want, it's still a christmas tree. If I were rasiging my children Jewish I wouldn't want tog ive them a 'chanukah bush' rather than imitating another religious symbol that means nothing, it's so much better to instill pride and excitement in children for their own religious symbols. I don't see anything wrong with a chanukah house and chanukah sugar cookies, it's cake..every holiday should have sweet treats..but having a hanukkah bush would be just as ridiculous as having a 12 candle menorah for the 12 days of christmas. Every religion has beautiful symbols and all children need to feel proud of who they are.

Mrs.Z Posted: Dec 07, 2005 11:50 AM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

I think you are 100% right. Not to sound like my grandma, but now a days people react to the stupidest thing, you cnt say this, that, or even hello sometimes. The whole world needs to relax a little a little less PC, a little more PEACE.

McSulllivan Posted: Dec 07, 2005 04:04 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

I have to say I'm so impressed with this board!
When I read the first post, I thought that people were going to jump all over Andrea. But all the responses were BRILLIANT! I agree 100% with Andrea and Leslie. Very well said! The Christmas tree is a Christmas tradition - not a religious symbol. It's true that we have become a country that placates people that feel 'left out' rather than celebrate what it is that makes us different. Trying to assimilate everything into one holiday, is bland, contrived and a slap in the face to all of us. It makes it impossible to appreciate other cultures and traditions and breeds intolerance.

Imagin916 Posted: Dec 07, 2005 04:21 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by Jax430
I would incredibly offended if someone asked me to call my chanukah menorah 'holiday candlesticks'!

And rightfully so!

Goldi1021 Posted: Dec 07, 2005 05:09 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by Jax430
Was the Chanukah house at least kosher?

YES! IT WAS!!!

Posted by McSulllivan

I have to say I'm so impressed with this board!
When I read the first post, I thought that people were going to jump all over Andrea. But all the responses were BRILLIANT! I agree 100% with Andrea and Leslie. Very well said! The Christmas tree is a Christmas tradition - not a religious symbol. It's true that we have become a country that placates people that feel 'left out' rather than celebrate what it is that makes us different. Trying to assimilate everything into one holiday, is bland, contrived and a slap in the face to all of us. It makes it impossible to appreciate other cultures and traditions and breeds intolerance.

I am all for diversity and celebrating and sharing different traditions with each other. I am not by any means anti-Christmas.I think its a meaningful holiday and recognize its importance to the people who celebrate it. After I light my menorah, in MY house, I will walk downstairs, to my landlord and his family, give them some cookies and wish them a Merry Christmas - not Happy Holidays.

I need me some ceremonial jelly doughnuts (WHICH IS WHAT WE EAT ON CHANUKAH) and call it a day!!!

MrsP2Be Posted: Dec 07, 2005 08:59 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Doughnuts? We'll have Chinese Food since it falls right around Christmas.

Goldi1021 Posted: Dec 07, 2005 11:35 PM

Re: Rant about the Rockefeller Tree 'holiday' thing please read!

Posted by MrsP2Be

Doughnuts? We'll have Chinese Food since it falls right around Christmas.

Oh on Chanukah we are supposed to eat potato latkes and jelly doughnuts. On Christmas, Jewish people eat Chinese food because nothing else is open! The first night of Chanukah falls on Christmas day!