Bowling for Columbine

here is a rebuttal of the email that was sent to me

A couple of things:

a.) 'In God We Trust' is not the national motto - it is 'E Pluribus Unum' (Out of many, one).

b.) After doing a little research (the Internet is great for checking facts!), I found that the motto was put on some US currency during the Civil War during the so-called 'religious revolution' that took place in the US during the mid 19th century. The motto was requested by many religious leaders and statesmen of the time. The orginal request was to place 'Our Country and Our God' on the currency, but it was later changed.

c.) I believe the Constitution states that there should be a clearly defined separation of church and state. Therefore, placing this motto on our currency, or anywhere where official (state sponsored) business is conducted is unconstitutional.

d.) One of the ideas behind the founding of this country was to allow people to live with religious, political, financial and moral freedom as long as these freedoms do not infringe on the rights of others to do the same. Posting 'In God We Trust' in schools infringes on my rights to religious freedom - the right to practice no religion at all or not believe in God, or not believe in just one god, etc.

e.) This writer (of the piece published in a tampa newspaper) also seems to believe that his God (presumabely the Christian God) is the right God while any other God is false.


i am just presenting what was sent to me. i am not the 'author' of these emails. please keep that in mind before you respond.

I would just like to add that I am not questioning if Michael Moore is pro-american or anti-american. I am not supporting his movies at this time because I think his comments were inappropriate at the time that he made them. He used the Oscars to tell people how he felt about the war that America just entered. While mothers and fathers and wives and husbands were only thinking about their loved ones that just got called to war, they had to turn on the Oscars and hear a man yelling about us going to war for fictious reasons. Sorry, wrong place, wrong time.

Will I see this movie at some point in my life? Yes I will. Right now it's all still to fresh for me and I'm not willing to look past his comments. I don't think I'm blind sided at all. I actually watched an interview with him a couple of months after the Oscars to hear his explanation. And it didn't change my mind about his comments. I understand why he made them, but I don't agree with using the Oscars to get your point across.

Karen I agree with a lot of things you said. Many famous people complain about this country. This country is the only country that they could get paid the amount of money they get. Yet they're not complaining when the middle class struggling american is budgeting $20 into their weekly figure to go support one of their movies that they're making millions for.

I love conspiracy theories, especially ones that question our government. If anyone ever wants to talk to me about the JFK assassination I could go on and on for hours and you'll want to kill me by the end of it. I know that I would love this movie, but right now I can't spend my money on seeing it. If it's on tv and I happen to see it, then fine. But Michael Moore is not getting any of my money.

just wanted to point out other Oscar comments...MM was NOT the only one...why do we chastise him?

**The initial reference to the current conflict was offered by the winner of the first major award—best supporting actor—Chris Cooper, for his role in Adaptation. After thanking his fellow nominees and paying tribute to actress Meryl Streep and his wife, Cooper continued, “In light of all the troubles in the world, I wish us all—peace,” laying considerable stress on the final word. His comment was greeted with an ovation.

Meanwhile ABC News continued to cut into the show, providing news of heavy fighting in Iraq.

Hayek presented the award for best foreign language film to Nowhere in Africa from Germany—about a family of German Jews who go into exile in Kenya—directed by Caroline Link. The filmmaker did not attend, due to her daughter’s illness, but from Berlin told reporters later that she opposed the US war. “I don’t really like America at the moment,” Link commented. “Such a high percentage of the population stands squarely behind their president’s politics. I find that a real turnoff.”

One presenter who had the courage to throw out the lines he had been assigned was Gael García Bernal, the star of the Mexican film Y Tu Mama Tambíen. Bernal, who was on hand to introduce a musical number from the movie Frida, the biography of Mexican leftist painter Frida Kahlo, launched a thinly-veiled attack on the Bush administration. He quoted Kahlo, “The necessity for peace in the world is not a dream, it is a reality,” and went on, “If Frida were alive, she would be on our side, against the war.” He also received applause.

Accepting an award for sound-editing, for The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers, sound designer Ethan Van der Ryn lamented that there was “so much insanity in the world.”


Only a few minutes after Moore’s comments, on receiving his award for best actor (in The Pianist), Adrien Brody made a heartfelt if somewhat confused plea for peace. After expressing surprise and joy at the award, Brody would not let the producers shut him up before he commented on the present situation: “It fills me with great joy, but also great sadness, because I’m accepting this award at such a strange time.” Then as the orchestra began to play over his words: “One second, one second, one second. Cut it out. I’m sorry. But you know, making this film made me very aware of the sadness and dehumanization of people at times of war. And the repercussions of war. And whatever you believe in, if it’s God or Allah, may he watch over you, and let’s pray for a peaceful and swift resolution.”

Oblique comments and criticisms were offered by a number of presenters.

Singer Barbra Streisand, a staunch supporter of the Democratic Party establishment, presenting the award for best song (won by Eminem for Lose Yourself), made a vague reference presumably to the current wave of attacks on antiwar actors and performers in the right-wing media when she said, “I’m very proud to live in a country that guarantees every citizen, including artists, the right to sing and to say what we believe.”

Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences president Frank Pierson rather piously commented, “I want to say Godspeed, let’s get our troops home soon, and to the Iraqi people, let’s have peace soon and let you live without war.” He neglected to mention that the chief obstacle to the Iraqis’ living in peace was the administration of his own country, which is waging a savage war against them.

One of the final award winners of the night, Spanish director Pedro Almodovar, spoke directly to the war, although his comments were not easily registered. Reading rapidly from a piece of paper, he dedicated his award for best original screenplay (for Talk to Her) to “all the people who are raising their voice in favor of peace, human rights, democracy, and international law, things that have been violated recently,” obviously referring to the Bush administration’s policy. Spain has been the scene of huge protest demonstrations and popular opinion is hostile to the government of Jose Maria Aznar, which supports the Iraq war.

Nominees who did not win, but intended to deliver anti-war comments, included British director Stephen Daldry and screenwriter David Hare (both for The Hours). Daldry told the British press before the ceremony that he would have no hesitation about using the Academy Awards as a platform to express his opinion about the war. “I certainly will mention the war in my speech; I think it would be impossible not to and I suspect most people will. I do not think the case for war has been made and most of the people I know feel the same. It could be that they think differently in Cincinnati but it certainly seems to be that way in New York.”

In terms of the awards handed out, there were a number of surprises worth noting at the 75th Awards ceremony. The Pianist, a moving and humane account of the Holocaust based on the memoirs of Polish pianist Wladislaw Szpilman, took three major awards—Brody for best actor, Ronald Harwood for best adapted screenplay and Roman Polanski was greeted with a standing ovation; the Polish-born director has been in exile since fleeing the US in 1977 over a statutory rape charge.**


http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/mar2003/osca-m25.shtml

other oscar comments...maybe we should boycott the Godfather?


**During Oscar's 50th anniversary show in 1978, Vanessa Redgrave, a left-wing political activist, delivered a passionate speech about Palestinian rights during her acceptance speech for the Best Actress Oscar for Julia. A near riot almost ensued backstage and presenter-writer Paddy Chayefsky was so intent on publicly refuting Redgrave that he forgot to read the list of nominees while presenting the award for Best Screenplay. Outside the auditorium there were hundreds of pro and anti-Palestinian demonstrators, some of who were burning Ms. Redgrave in effigy, and the L.A. SWAT team was called out to disperse them. Ironically, Redgrave's win reflected the impartiality of AMPAS' many Jewish voters who had awarded her the Oscar despite her outspoken anti-Zionist views.


**In 1973, Marlon Brando, who was then active in native rights politics, sent 'Indian Princess' Sacheen Littlefeather to the ceremony in his place as he had been nominated for Best Actor for his portrayal of Vito Corleone in The Godfather. When 007 actor Roger Moore announced Brando as the winner, Ms. Littlefeather mounted the stage, refused the Oscar, and delivered a prepared speech on native rights. It later turned out that she wasn't even a native. The Oscar was never collected by Brando and is still in AMPAS' possession.


**In 1992, gay activists threatened to disrupt the ceremonies to protest what they considered to be negative stereotypes of gays in Hollywood movies particularly two films nominated for Best Picture, Silence of the Lambs and JFK. While the television audience was unaware of the protests outside, the host of the telecast, Billy Crystal, and many of the stars wore red ribbons indicating sympathy with AIDS victims and a few commented on this while accepting and presenting awards.

Ironically, Silence of the Lambs, one of the films that was the focus of much rage from the gay community, won Oscars in the five major categories (Actor, Actress, Director, Screenplay and Film). Only two other films in Oscar history managed to win in the 'big five'; It Happened One Night in 1934 and 1975's One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

If you think that our leaders have the nation's best interests in mind (nation = everyday people) and not their politcal party's interests or the interests of corporations (sometimes the same thing) you are naive.

Vote and read and keep the debate going, but don't just blindly call liberals anti-American and conservatives stupid. We should always keep our minds open and keep informed and vote/protest/give our $ in support of our causes.

I'm not boycotting the other movies or people because I didn't find their comments to be as harsh and inappropriate.

-Chris Cooper wished us all peace. I'm ok with that.
-The filmmaker Caroline Link passed her comments after the Oscars
-Bernal...well first off I don't even know who this person is so I wouldn't even know how to boycott his movies. He implied he's against the war. That's fine, he did not attack the president and the war with his words.
-The LOR guy...I agree there is a lot of insanity in this world and he also did not pass any harsh comments.
-Brody...I think his comments were beautiful. He bascially said whoever you believe in, whatever your religion is, pray for a quick war.

I could go on and on responding to the other comments, but I wont. As far as previous Oscars go I wasn't around to see the ones in the 70's and I'm not able to make a decision on that now. My views now are different than the people of the 70's. Maybe I would have been offended back then.

Hey Michele did you ever think you would start such a conversation by posting a movie review

Clueless you do not sound clueless at all to me

I thought Bowling was a real eyeopener!

I think that this was a great thread...so many different opinions...yet did you notice that we were all so mature about it!!!


oh BTW gollum from LOTR(the guy who played him Andy Serkis) held up a pretty obnoxious sign outside the oscars...but i can't remember what it said...

Yabbo..

just wanted to point out other Oscar comments...MM was NOT the only one...why do we chastise him?

It's not the fact that he had something to say, but HOW he said it. All the others said what they had to say, but didn't rant and rave and make direct insults to people. He was out of control. That's what was offensive.

I don't agree with any political party- and this is sort of off-topic:

But if so many people are ANTI war for oil, why the HECK does EVERYONE drive around in gas consuming SUVs and then COMPLAIN about the prices of gas?

I'm sorry if you guys have SUVs and feel insulted by this, but I think SUVs are STUPID. We live in the tri-state area- the land of paved roads and snow plows. Is the .05% of the time you use the 4 wheel drive really worth it? After all, we are fighting a war over gas and oil! And if you really needed a 'safe' vehicle with '4x4' capabilities wouldn't you get one of those Subarus or something?

When I buy a car, I try to get something that gets a lot of mileage for the gallon- I don't feel the need to participate in this over-consumption society.

Off the soap box now :)

Sassyz75, I could NOT agree w/you more re: the SUV thing. In fact, many of the women on this thread right now are probably hypocrits about that very same fact you posted (against war for oil, but complain about gas prices and drive gas-guzzling SUV's).

Personally, I do not understand the SUV 'revolution' either. I see them merely as status symbols in a society that is over-indulged on SO MANY levels that they cannot even see 2 feet in front of themselves!

Months ago, there was a thread about new cars/trucks and I said we were considering a station wagon. Someone commented that a wagon was 'too soccer Mom' for their taste.

Well, what the heck do you THINK the SUV has become??? TOTAL SOCCER MOM, there!

Personally I like SUV's for a safety reason. It has nothing to do with the snow. Although it is nice to be able to drive in an SUV when the rest of the tri-state area is snowed in. I was in an accident about a month ago and my Pathfinder only needed a new bumper, about $1,500. And we were both fine. The other car needed a whole new back, including a trunk. And the passenger in the back had to be taken to the hospital. I'll pay extra money in gas for that safety.

I also have a Camry and I complain every time I have to fill that car up also. $2 a gallon for gas? It's just too much and we ALL, SUV and non-SUV drivers, use it too much. I know people compare it to how much milk is. It would take me 6 months to spend $30 worth of milk. With my SUV I spend that in a week, my Camry takes about 2 weeks.

I would also like to add that I complained about gas prices well before I had my SUV. Maybe I am a hypocrite, but the prices are still insane. I'd like for someone to tell me how the prices are reasonable.

In terms of safety- you just proved my point. The accident you had probably wouldn't have been so bad if the other car wasn't hit by an SUV... I wonder how that car would've fared if it was hit by a 'like' car... This is what happens when regular cars are hit by SUVs that were originally designed for military use (which is what the Jeep was originally designed for). It's like why don't I just buy a Semi- I'm sure if a Semi hit your Pathfinder it would get totalled- you see what I'm saying- it's not a like vehicle.

I have a BIG problem with SUVs- besides the gas consumption... they are marketed as safe vehicles when there's a lot of research otherwise... Plus I have a hard time driving when one is behind me because the lights glare right into my rearview mirror.

Plus- the safety ratings of SUVs fail in comparison (according to Consumer Reports) when compared with a Volvo or even a Suburu.

But in the end- I really think it's a trend- it says, look how much money I have- not only have I spent 30k plus on a truck- but I can pay $30 every other day to put gas in it...

The way I see it- why spend so much money on a car/SUV anyway- it loses value as SOON as you drive it off the lot.. I'll drive crap cars for the rest of my life- and have all the more to retire with... plus all that extra money I didn't spend on gas :)

k...I'm just a big fan of freedom of speech...in the words of Voltaire...'I may not agrre with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it'


and I for one have 2 very gas friendly cars...one gets 25-30 and the other 30-35!!!

although...we are looking into a wrangler...but we have a beach house and we need to be able to drive over the sand in some parts to get there...lol...my jetta got stuck the last time!!!


but I think living in NYC for so long made a walker out of me...I asked someone out here where a drug store was and they said down the street...I asked if I could walk there...and she looked at me very strangely and said...'I guess you could walk'...the drug store was ONE block from where we were!!!!

sassy...the lights get to me too...and I always hated the SUV drivers (I know not all) who think that they are invinsible in the snow and ride up on me when I am trying to drive slow and steady...in snow storms - 99% of the accidents are SUVs...pay attention this winter...the djs usually make a point of mentioning it...

It's not just the lights from the SUVs glaring into your rearview mirror that I HATE - but the poor visability you have of the REST OF THE ROAD when you're on a highway and surrounded by 4x4's or BIGGER!

And someone pleeeeeezzze tell me WHY so many people THINK they NEED a Hummer to drive on FLAT Long Island??? We don't live in the Rocky Mountains, nor do we live in a friggin' combat zone, so why are people driving these monstrosities in SUBURBIA?????????????????????????

I was in France and Italy this summer and everyone drove a tiny little car - it was like 'Here are all the sane people!'

I don't even have a license b/c I grew up in the city, so I am totally biased toward public tranportation. But really, big giant SUVs look really silly to me, JMO.

I have to disagree about the damage. My mother has a Corolla and she was in an accident about 2 months ago. I don't remember the type of car she hit, but it was not an SUV. She was not going fast, maybe about 15-20 mph. Her car could have been totalled if she decided to go that way, instead she let her insurance fork out over $6,000 to fix the car. Also, how many times of you seen smaller cars get into accidents where both cars wiped each other out? I see it quite a bit.

As far as safety goes, I have a Pathfinder and it's known to be one of the safest because it's built on a car base, not on a truck base. And IMO I feel it is much safer and easier to drive when you have a car that's higher up. You truly see the road, lights, stop signs, etc. a lot better.