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LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

Original post by Taunita

I recently received an FM from --- (I refuse to post bc heaven forbid I get another fm) and the intent of this is not to reflect negatively on someone merely performing their job and I’m sure it was sent if only to cover all bases and as an FYI (perhaps it was a uniform blanket sent to all those who posted)…?? Anywaze this was in regards to advice for me not to “warn” other brides about a particular limo company in question – supposedly in my best interest and to protect me. I hope y’all know what limo company I’m referring too…

First and foremost – I Luv this website and I think client services are beyond awesome and do an amazing job!!!!!!!!

With that being said - I understand that that may have to protect vendors but what about us?

I did post a response on that thread –two posts to be exact – 1) I stated that I would be sure to steer clear thanking her for her honest review and that she should report them to the better business bureau. 2) She asked for help spreading the word so I recommended she post her review on yelp and the yellow pages and that I was horrified by what she experienced and she should take them to court. (Never mentioned the name of the company) & 3) (Separate thread) A bride was inquiring about a unique car idea and I told her to do research before booking due to prior negative reviews (someone else referenced the company earlier in the thread). (I didn’t mention the name and advised her to research before booking which would call upon her own judgment) and we tell brides to research different photography options everyday so what’s the big deal on this particular company- why should they get special treatment!???… What exactly was I being warned about and protection from what? Because in my opinion – that was an opinion – not even negatively reviewing them except for the fact that I mentioned they had negative reviews (no further details included) on these other sites (which is fact): surprise surprise.

I also sent an fm to a total of three brides who solicited information on another post regarding the aforementioned so I provided them with just the name of the company (and that’s it). But never publicly displayed in any way shape or form unless the content of my fm is assumed– so unless the “right to change policy” (privacy policy page) has been exercised – I don’t see how this was harmful as it was an internal communication, which supposedly is not displayed to vendors.

I felt threatened by this message, even though it was “in my best interest” because it made me apprehensive in regards to stating my opinions and made me feel as though they were in fact looking out for the vendors best interest and that I was simply being warned; actually told to “refrain” from replying in this thread with a thanks for my support and understanding. I understand it may have something to do with compliance but I do not support this stance.

So with that being said I don’t see how I did anything wrong – I thought this was about brides helping brides???

I don't think we should pay the ultimate price for vendors who suc*k and there should be a better screening process for the vendors they choose (or higher standards) to advertise or some sort of contract review and renewal process... their are plenty of viable and honest vendors on waiting list for this site (because vendors I met with have mentioned this before) and someone else should be given the chance to prevail where others have failed! & That’s my three cents! I understand there are often mixed reviews with certain vendors (all subject to oPiNiOn) but they shouldn’t be protected by only good reviews… In my opinion I think this aids a false representation of the company.

Oh and as far as best interest:

These posts are specifically in an area designated for opinion anything other than that is speculation by the vendor. “Long Island Brides helping Long Island Brides!
Come and post your Long Island Wedding concerns, solutions, dilemmas or just blow off some steam. Receive some advice or just hear what other Long Island brides and grooms have to say” That’s the intro before any one logs into BHB. Word for word. Soooooo… what up?

Just because they pay$ doesn’t mean we should pay the ultimate price of tears on our wedding day and after-all -opinions are simply what we have to say based on our personal judgment- brides should be able to make well informed choices through research, review and recommendations, which I’m sure we all do… posts like these merely contribute to decision making but by no means enforces a choice. We make final conclusions and one good opinion may weigh just the same as a negative depiction therefore who’s to say we wont judge for ourselves?

Furthermore, there's a clear difference between libel/slander and opinion. Stating your opinion is a protected constitutional right. It’s not a smear campaign.

I never had an experience with this company and mereley sympathized with the bride as I am sure all of you can understand… I never posted anything against this company nor did I mention them and responded to the inquiry on a post via fm… If my best interest are in fact affected by this – I should sue over freedom of speech – there was no defamation, slander, or offense. I mean Im surprized mcdonalds is still selling burgers god forbid someone sues over a heart attack? Sh*t B*tch next thing you know I’m going to go ape sh*t on someone for breathing on me and take them to court for getting a cold.

…Because after all isn’t that what my “protected interest” boils down too or am I subject to the same crime of assumption and speculation?

Sorry for the rant (actually I’m really not)– and mind you I have not yet had the need to post a thread until today (other than botw week and because y’all are ever so helpful and usually a search does the trick) but I was outraged by this.

I personally think this is a Double standard on an honest opinion – Yay for good nay for bad – what is up with that…

I hope I still get a t-shirt with my 1000th post but I’ve always stood up for what I believe in and my opinion is simply that. My opinion! & No one can take that away.
Im getting Married Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

This thread has long responses..I just want to add my 2 cents..I have seen posts deleted from people that have had personal experience with a vendor

I also understand it is a business for Ron, Liz and Kim. I just always hope to get a chance to read a thread before it gets pulled
FutureMcBride Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by JLWSJC

And finally, for everyone who keeps saying we should be allowed to state our opinions... we are allowed to do so. Just in a certain context. And, if you notice, there are plenty of vendors on The Brides Review who get bad grades and poor reviews and those posts don't get touched because of the way they are written and phrased. It's all about semantics and language and it's irritating sometimes, I agree, but it is the way it is.

Are you sure that those companies getting negative reviews are vendors that DON'T advertise on this site?

I don't know either way, but I have said this before, and like all of you trust and enjoy this site, but at the same time find it hard to believe that when LIW works with its advertisers, they don't assure them that they won't allow negative reviews on the very same site that they are advertising on.

I am by no means a law student, but I don't think it takes a lawyer to see that so many people have gotten posts removed for stating something that can hardly be defined as 'defamatory'. I hope no one is offended by that statement, since I don't mean it to be that way at all, it's just that so many people have been so confused as to why their posts were removed.
Taunita Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by alli3131

... and if they thought the OP was doing something against the 'rules' then they probably were.....even though they might not have realized what they were doing was wrong.



I'm pretty sure i was playing by the rules and to prove it:

Feel free to check on my posts:

Post 1 and 2

*Correction to OP I initially suggested yelp in post 1, to which she she asked what it was, which lead to post 2 - But there's still nothing wrong in that.

Post 3

& to restate - Telling some one to research in order to make an informed decision is not spreading the bad experience. I actually said the specific car they provided was a unique idea in the very same post and said to research because there were some bad reviews posted (which is fact) I provided no details regarding the reviews themselves & I was not focusing on the one review. I wasn't passing anything on except my actual opinion that being, that I had seen negative reviews and that was in fact my experience hence why I reccomended the research nothing else bad was stated about the company. We tell brides on here to research flowers, photography, etc. everyday and ask about eachothers experiences.

~ I wonder of any other brides received the same message~

Regarding the fm: To be clear - brides posted a thread asking other brides 'who was that limo company ...' (something to that note). It was a question regarding the topic that had been discussed via the famous thread. To which they received an answer, nothing more stating anything further other than the name to satisfy their inquiry. No one sent me a personal fm - because it was not my experience to talk about/reccomend.
adelya21 Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

ITA!! I had a post removed about a florist I saw and I made sure to phrse it in the most undefamatory way. They def do give vendors that are listed here protection!

Posted by FutureMcBride


Posted by JLWSJC

And finally, for everyone who keeps saying we should be allowed to state our opinions... we are allowed to do so. Just in a certain context. And, if you notice, there are plenty of vendors on The Brides Review who get bad grades and poor reviews and those posts don't get touched because of the way they are written and phrased. It's all about semantics and language and it's irritating sometimes, I agree, but it is the way it is.

Are you sure that those companies getting negative reviews are vendors that DON'T advertise on this site?

I don't know either way, but I have said this before, and like all of you trust and enjoy this site, but at the same time find it hard to believe that when LIW works with its advertisers, they don't assure them that they won't allow negative reviews on the very same site that they are advertising on.

I am by no means a law student, but I don't think it takes a lawyer to see that so many people have gotten posts removed for stating something that can hardly be defined as 'defamatory'. I hope no one is offended by that statement, since I don't mean it to be that way at all, it's just that so many people have been so confused as to why their posts were removed.

FutureMrsLMS Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

A lot of brides have sent me FMs about that particular limo company. I actually have dealt w/ that specific vendor on a personal level and did not have a good experience. I have no problems telling anyone over FM about my experiences w. various vendors...

I also am an attorney and agree with much of whats been already posted. CS is correct that they have the right to delete posts because it *is* THEIR site, and they do owe *some* kind of 'loyalty' to the vendors that are paying advertising revenue for marketing here. But Taunita is correct that there is a certain 'tone' in which certain messages are specifically targeted for removal and its a very delicate balance between what is actually written (verbiage) and what the poster intended to communicate.

If CS was really 'nazi' like, they could have just deleted the entire thread discussing that bride's 'horrific' experience..but they didn't. As stated above, what you say here CAN be actionable. Just google 'Ciolli v. Auto Admit' (case of Anthony Ciolli, a UPenn Law student who ran a Legal Message board where anonymous users were posting racist and sexist threads about 3 Yale Law students and the Yale students decided to sue the entire board, Ciolli personally and were able to have the site almost shut down. The 'anonymous' posters were never identified but enough damage was done to those who were identified - including Ciolli who lost his summer job at a large law firm over the ensuing brouhaha).

LIW/CS obviously does not want things to escalate to that degree. Just remember that as much as we want to really know the good, the BAD and the ugly of ALL vendors (paying or non-paying), CS will always have that 'Big Brother' aura here and we need to be mindful of that presence whenever we click 'post reply' here.

JessNicole7EM Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by FutureMrsLMS

A lot of brides have sent me FMs about that particular limo company. I actually have dealt w/ that specific vendor on a personal level and did not have a good experience. I have no problems telling anyone over FM about my experiences w. various vendors...

I also am an attorney and agree with much of whats been already posted. CS is correct that they have the right to delete posts because it *is* THEIR site, and they do owe *some* kind of 'loyalty' to the vendors that are paying advertising revenue for marketing here. But Taunita is correct that there is a certain 'tone' in which certain messages are specifically targeted for removal and its a very delicate balance between what is actually written (verbiage) and what the poster intended to communicate.

If CS was really 'nazi' like, they could have just deleted the entire thread discussing that bride's 'horrific' experience..but they didn't. As stated above, what you say here CAN be actionable. Just google 'Ciolli v. Auto Admit' (case of Anthony Ciolli, a UPenn Law student who ran a Legal Message board where anonymous users were posting racist and sexist threads about 3 Yale Law students and the Yale students decided to sue the entire board, Ciolli personally and were able to have the site almost shut down. The 'anonymous' posters were never identified but enough damage was done to those who were identified - including Ciolli who lost his summer job at a large law firm over the ensuing brouhaha).

LIW/CS obviously does not want things to escalate to that degree. Just remember that as much as we want to really know the good, the BAD and the ugly of ALL vendors (paying or non-paying), CS will always have that 'Big Brother' aura here and we need to be mindful of that presence whenever we click 'post reply' here.





I think this post finally made some sense on here.

Very well said.
Dramatica Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

just as a side comment...there are a lot of brides in the legal field
JLWSJC Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by JessNicole7EM


Posted by FutureMrsLMS






I think this post finally made some sense on here.

Very well said.



I agree.

But I didn't make any sense Jess?
JLWSJC Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by Dramatica

just as a side comment...there are a lot of brides in the legal field



JessNicole7EM Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by JLWSJC


Posted by JessNicole7EM


Posted by FutureMrsLMS






I think this post finally made some sense on here.

Very well said.



I agree.

But I didn't make any sense Jess?



*EDIT* Jamie's post made sense too. She's so smarrrrrt.

<3 Jamie

lol better?
JLWSJC Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by JessNicole7EM


Posted by JLWSJC


Posted by JessNicole7EM


Posted by FutureMrsLMS






I think this post finally made some sense on here.

Very well said.



I agree.

But I didn't make any sense Jess?



*EDIT* Jamie's post made sense too. She's so smarrrrrt.



<3 Jamie

lol better?



BWAHAHAHAHAHA, much!
FutureMrsLMS Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

you guys are funny. wheres that 'thumbs up' icon? We all are smart, come on! we are LIW'ers eh??
lisagail55 Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by JessNicole7EM


Posted by FutureMrsPanuch


Posted by JessNicole7EM

Well this looks like it's going to get out of hand pretty soon.



i think it might have already...




yeah i think so.



So many posts with too many words... I'm getting a headache. Yowzah!
RaeloveMeg Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~


Posted by mybabylovesmoi

adeyla - I agree with everything you said and love that you took the time to write all that out and make it easy to follow.

I'm sorry, if I am paying for a service and I get screwed, I will speak about it. The flip side is if I have a FABULOUS experience, everybody will hear about that too.

Why shouldn't bad business owners (who've already taken someone's money) face consequences and good business owners reap rewards?

If a vendor consistently gets bad reviews, their first priority should be to fix the problem, not sue people to keep their mouths shut.

just my 2 cents.



ITA!!!! The good comes with the good and the bad come with the bad!!
LIWeddings Posted:

Re: LiStEn uP… Read if you will ~!~!~!~

It's amazing how some things get blown out of proportion.

To the OP - the admin simply sent you an FM asking you not to use the word warning! Why? Because it can be viewed as liable and yes the vendor can sue you for that and they will win. So yes this is in your best interest. Did the admin ask you not to post? Nope! Just not to use verbiage that can either get you in trouble or cause your post to be removed. There are many other posts from me on this topic. You can search for them to see other conversations on this topic.

To the person who posted something about free speech. That has to do with people talking about the government and has zero to do with message boards. But while on that topic of free speech, yes you have freedom of speech against the government but you can not post liable against them. Neither can you do that here!

Anyway, just wanted to jump in real fast. This topic has been covered many times before so just search for them.

All The Best!

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