Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Original post by Xelindrya

Mar 01, 2004 05:39 PM

I don't mean does it matter to you that YOU have higher education. The question is do you react when finding out someone else's education level.

For example you mean this complete idiot. heh.. Not just acts stupid but REALLY REALLY is a bit on the slow side. Not dumb just not sharp if that makes sense. The type you have to truly draw a picture for, literally (I do this at my job). You know, write down the numbers so they see that 2 plus 2 really does add up. Then you find out this person has a BA in Math.

Does this make you think:
1- Oh maybe it was just an off day because someone as educated as that can't possibly NOT grasp simple things like this. It must be a mistake or my fault for not explaning myself clearly.

Or

2- Get the name of that school so my children won't apply!!!!

Same goes in reverse. Ever meet someone who is very well spoken and has a good knowledge base. You know the sharp type. Never needs further explanations just 'gets' it and absorbs new tasks easily. Then you find out this person only has a GED or HS Diploma and think:
1- You lose a bit of respect for that person. They just aren't as bright as you thought, probably just luck or this stuff is REALLY easy anyhow.

or

2- Shame they didnt finish school, they already have so much going for them. I know fools with less practical use of their brains with higher educations. Shame shame shame but I won't think less of them. Instead I applaud them for getting so far and not stopping.

Just curious what the reaction is.

steph4777 Posted: Mar 02, 2004 04:49 PM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by Xelindrya

Posted by Sassyz75

not only performance, but what FUTURE benefit can you expect from someone?? I believe (and flame me if you want) that 99.9% of the time you can expect more diversity from those with degrees and advanced degrees- b/c 9 times out of 10, those people have had to learn diverse types of information (math, science, language, etc) and to me, that shows that they are diverse and versatile and can process and learn a variety of information that could potentially make them an asset to a corporation in a role different from that they were hired later down the road.

I can see that from your standpoint.

But instead I see grad students coming to my company learning what they need and LEAVING because they have that piece of paper and their experience and can leave.

Those of us with 'just' experience have made mistakes and learned from them. We are more likely to stay because ... lets face it for my industry this is it. It's not like I can change and get paid the same. I dont have that advantage. I think it's too vague to say that a college grad is more diverse than an non grad. Im diverse because I've been in three fields of my industry and worked in two very odd states for my industry. *shrug*

Each case is different.

Veronica, can I ask what industry you are in? In your earlier posts you mentioned that professional designations and MBA programs, so I am assuming financial services.

What's wrong with taking the experience and moving on to another opportunity when you finish grad school? When you finish with your degree won't you take advantage of the fact that you have more options available to you?

And it's not just a 'piece' of paper, if it was then everyone would have it. I work hard working full time and finishing up my MBA. Going to college/grad school is a commitment and investment that I made in myself. I have learned so much more in grad school than if I just worked. You meet new people, share experiences and see how it is applied in a work setting.

Xelindrya Posted: Mar 02, 2004 04:54 PM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by alina
Veronica, do you think the grads are leaving your company b/c the competitive jobs are just not there for them? Perhaps is not the problems with grads leaving the company, but a problem with company?

LOL actually the problem IS the company.. it's a bit too good. It's widely known that once you work here sucessfully you can pretty much write your ticket at any other company. We are the top of our ladder in the feild. My old office hired people from this company like they were gods. It didnt matter what they did its just they did it at 'this' company.

I see grad students openly talk about how this job gives them a boost up. We over pay our grad students and give them a whole year of extensive training. Three times within the first 6 months we send our grad students out of state to be 'educated'. They get VIP treatment and know it. They openly admit that they are using what this company gives them to their advantage (and I would too!). They get to meet the big wigs of other companies in our industry. They spend quality with big cheeses in our office.

ETA
I was on the phone my line of thought was lost.

Look at least 'here' grad students who are VERY unexperienced and yes.. a bit cocky get royal treatment and salary while hard working experienced (WIDELY experienced) people like myself are pushed aside. It's a BAD choice. I am more likely to stay than they are. Just lately I joined an internal committee to address this problem.

Frankly tho... education in this day and age IS the standard we are all held to. Nothing I can do to change that. I will go to college I just feel it's a shame to hold back others because of their lack of college degree. For me there's no excuse. I am in the age group that college degree is the norm but for some of my older coworkers it seems unfair. JMHO.

halloweenbride04 Posted: Mar 02, 2004 05:02 PM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by yabbobay

I admit...in the past that I almost thought a BA was a prerequisite for guys that I dated...
boy did DH give me a swift kick in my bum for that theory!!!

Me too Yabbobay. I met FH through an online personal ad (love@aol) and I out that my potential mate should have at least a BA (I have an M.S.) I dated a few very educated guys, an MSW, an MD, an M.S. ed, a PH. D candidate, but that didn't mean they were better people. I met FH and the subject of his schooling never came up until 3 or 4 dates later and I found out he had an AAS from Suffolk and 2 years of a BA and gave school up. I seriously never met a smarter guy and his educational level meant nothing to me.

August2004 Posted: Mar 02, 2004 05:18 PM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

From personal experience I can tell you that education level has nothing to do with actually being a smart person. I am going to school for my Master's degree right now and I swear I don't know how some of my classmates tie their shoes in the morning. Dumb is not the word for some of them.

Becky Posted: Mar 03, 2004 07:55 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by Xelindrya

I will go to college I just feel it's a shame to hold back others because of their lack of college degree. For me there's no excuse. I am in the age group that college degree is the norm but for some of my older coworkers it seems unfair. JMHO.

I look at the other side of the coin. I went to college to earn my BA and law degrees because I wanted to further my career potential. I put in years of my life and a ton of money for those degrees and I expect, and quite frankly deserve, to be compensated accordingly. Otherwise, why would anyone go to college ever??? So I don't think that your company is holding you back because you don't have a degree, I see them compensating people who worked hard to earn a degree which is probably a requirement for advancement.

Tammy5-03 Posted: Mar 03, 2004 08:34 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

I totally agree.

Xelindrya Posted: Mar 03, 2004 08:42 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

I never implied that compensating for a degree is not valid.

You miss my point.

Im saying if you don't have a degree it shouldnt mean your company can't compensate you for a job well done.
'You did great.. would love to show it, but you have no degree so we really don't have to. Afterall what are you going to do? Leave? Who wants to hire a non-grad?'

ChristineC68 Posted: Mar 03, 2004 08:45 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Becky, I completely agree with you. I think higher education is an investment and the people that have suceeded in that arena deserve to have a little more opportunity.

I never finished college but I have been lucky to attain the position and salary I have. This is for several reasons including my hard work and diligence as well as my boss' confidence and expertise that I learned so much from.

And while I am fully qualified to do my job I know I am not exactly qualified to do this at another company - I would be starting with a learning curve and a much lower salary because I do not have a degree.

Becky Posted: Mar 03, 2004 09:23 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by Xelindrya

I never implied that compensating for a degree is not valid.

You miss my point.

Im saying if you don't have a degree it shouldnt mean your company can't compensate you for a job well done.
'You did great.. would love to show it, but you have no degree so we really don't have to. Afterall what are you going to do? Leave? Who wants to hire a non-grad?'

Why is it that everytime I disagree with someone they think I do not understand their point???? (That is said in a lighthearted tone and is to be taken lightly )

I hear ya and I understand where you are coming from. I just disagree. In this competitive job market, companies are requiring degrees when they did not in the past. The reason people go to college and earn degrees is to avoid being stuck in the position you are in. If you take away the benefit of that security that you have afer acquiring a college level degree than there is no point in going to college at all.

Xelindrya Posted: Mar 03, 2004 10:41 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Posted by Becky
Why is it that everytime I disagree with someone they think I do not understand their point???? (That is said in a lighthearted tone and is to be taken lightly )

I hear ya and I understand where you are coming from. I just disagree. In this competitive job market, companies are requiring degrees when they did not in the past. The reason people go to college and earn degrees is to avoid being stuck in the position you are in. If you take away the benefit of that security that you have afer acquiring a college level degree than there is no point in going to college at all.

So we agree?
It's unfair but that's life?

steph4777 Posted: Mar 03, 2004 11:59 AM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

Don't hate the playa, hate the game. I don't make the rules I just play by them.... Until one is in a position to make a change you sometimes unfortunely have to play the game.

But I can see your point about it not being fair to not compensate or promote people who are clearly qualified solely on the reason that they don't have a degree.

tourist Posted: Mar 03, 2004 01:33 PM

Re: Spinoff of Ciminok's Education Post: Does it matter to you?

My FH & I both work with a lot of Phd's and joke that the more education you have the denser you become when it comes to practical knowledge & common sense. Not to offend any phd's, but we both hate our jobs . . .

My dad has people under him at work with MBA's & LAW degrees, because they kind of have to now, where as he only has a BA & his colleague only has a HS diploma & does the same thing.
I think experiecne used to matter more than it does now.

I think the big change in my mentality was from my cousin. We are the same age & took different paths & he is a little envious tha tI amalready doen with my bs ( we are 27) & he is still thinkign abotu if he shoudl get one. I on the other hand admire that he has moved around more & has more varied experiecen ( including a failed attepmt at openig a bar)

I think the more people you meet , you realize that education comes in various forms.