More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Original post by marymoon
I think NO WAY!
beautyq115
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by LMFitz
I think both Clinton's should go back to Arkansas and leave NY alone! I can't stand either of them (not that I'm a big Pirro fan either ).
And I have no problems with blow jobs - but I have a problem with our president doing it with someone other than his wife (but seriously---would she?) - and then lying about it.
I agree..I can't stand either of them
SomethingBlu
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by dpli
Posted by eogara
Thanks! That's exactly what I meant. It was also, of course, a little dig (couldn't resist ). In the end, though, those things come first and foremost - they are way more important to me than the social issues because, IMO while obviously it's great to have rights, you have to be alive and have a job to enjoy them.
I guess I see things as less black and white than that, and think that many of the social issues are intertwined with the ones you are calling realistic. I do not have party affiliation, and lean more to the liberal side of things, but tend to be a bit more conservative on financial matters.
Was really just trying to understand a different point of view.
I guess I do too...with so much poverty and crime and seeing it all first hand...it's difficult to be so 'black and white' about things when there's such a large grey area.
As for politics, I am a registered Democrat not because I completely agree with the party (I actually liked Nader) but because I'm not nearly rich enough (nor is anyone I know) to be a Republican or have that system work for me.
takeoutcook
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
Posted by takeoutcook
and yes, Bill Clinton, a politician, lied - They ALL do, regardless of party.
They don't all break the law with their lies. He lied under oath about using his power as President of the United States to gain sexual favors from one of his interns.
That's not disturbing to you??
As far as 'it didn't lead us to war' - nope, it lead us to September 11th. While Clinton got laid, Osama played. Just something to keep in mind the next time you want to compare presidents
I'm sorry - but what in my one line quote said all that?
Yes Bill Clinton lied under oath. I never said I wasn't disturbed by it. He cheated on his wife - as did Kennedy, as did Jefferson, as did Hoover, etc. I dont excuse that behavior.
I also never said that his lie never led us to war. . . I'm really not sure what in my post you're referring to.
I also did not compare presidents. . . I just pointed out that politicians lie. I don't believe I took any side - republican or democrat.
re: 9/11 - while a lot of Clinton haters would like to blame 9/11 on his behavior, and a lot of Bush haters would like to blame 9/11 on him, I dont believe you can blame that horrendous event on one president - it was years in the planning and was the result of years of hating American foreign policy.
Xelindrya
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by Blu-ize
Pirro is a b*tch. I've had a personal experience with her.
uhm so have i. sorry you feel so uhmm 'strongly'
Politics aside.. I find her inspiring. We asked her to speak at our last major insurance event and she was moving, riveting and impressive.
I personally think Hillary is a winner only because of her name not for what she's done. She's a two faced liar who lives on the waves of 'misquotes' when it suits her and rages on 'misunderstood comments' when they aren't to her advantage.
Hillary winning at ALL is going to be a horrid shame.. but so was her winning in the beginning but she knew that when she came here.
Oh well... I vote and I put in my opinion.. that's the best I can do. *shrug*
OSCARtheGROOM
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
Posted by takeoutcook
and yes, Bill Clinton, a politician, lied - They ALL do, regardless of party.
They don't all break the law with their lies. He lied under oath about using his power as President of the United States to gain sexual favors from one of his interns.
That's not disturbing to you??
As far as 'it didn't lead us to war' - nope, it lead us to September 11th. While Clinton got laid, Osama played. Just something to keep in mind the next time you want to compare presidents
Goldi1021
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
If any one of you can find a politician wihout ghosts, lies or weed in their closet, then great lord almighty, they got my vote. Beggars can't be choosers. We do the best with what we have and sometimes the best just ain't good enough.
PrincessRose
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
While Clinton got laid, Osama played.
Just thought I'd post this excerpt from an article for you: 'When asked about president Clinton's performance on defense the only criticism Paul Wolfowitz had was Bill Clinton's obsession with Osama bin Laden. Clinton's plan to eliminate al Qaeda root and branch was completed only weeks before the inauguration of George W. Bush. Clinton's National Security Advisor Sandy Berger arranged ten briefings for his successor, Condoleezza Rice, and her deputy, Stephen Hadley. He told Dr. Rice, 'I believe that the Bush administration will spend more time on terrorism in general, and on al Qaeda specifically, than any other subject.'''
And I don't think he used his power as president to get sexual favors from an intern. He's a relatively good looking guy, and extraordinarily charismatic. Monica was probably into him anyway.
Finally, I don't think that there is anything more important in this country than Freedom. Freedom of Religion, Freedom of Expression, Freedom of Speech. Benjamin Franklin said 'He who gives up liberty for security deserves neither.' And I think that these things are a lot more important than my pocketbook, which I'll add has been signifcantly fuller under democrats than it ever was under a republican president.
Personally though, I think that our government's strength and true justice (as opposed to displaced vengeance) are a lot more important than whether or not I can afford a coach bag.
Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
I agree 100%
JPC1125
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
Posted by JPC1125 I now look as people who I thought I liked and am left wondering ' how can you honestly think like that?'
Kind of shallow to have someone's political views change your entire opinion of them, no?
I didnt see this as shallow...I think its very realistic to find yourself conflicted that someone you thought you knew does not share your same views. This is why I stay away from political and religious talk at work. When I found out a teacher at work is wife to one of our state senators who is Replublican, I couldnt look at her the same way for some reason. Knowing that she supports things that I don't made me think of her differently. I didnt want to but I feel that our beliefs are core to who we are.
marymoon
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
I don't think it's ashllow at all. A person's beliefs tell you who they are. Shallow is judging someone on looks, clothing or their fave coldstone flavor. The things someone values are at the core of who they are. I have to say that most of my friends have similar political views to mine. That doesn't mean that I can't be friends with peopl,e with opposing beliefs, but we often disagree on bigger issues. Do I care if you voted for Bush or Kerry? Will that make or break a friendship? no. But if you're saying that my gay friends are cauing tghe breakdown of the family, then we may have a problem.
dihaus
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
George Washington told the people that were going to be his successors that political parties will be the downfall of our government....people are fighting over who is the better candidate, usually not because of the candidates beliefs and political stands, but because their party affiliation...it is sad that party affiliation stands in the way of progress in America...what happened to the cooperation that the government experienced between the two parties in 2001 and 2002...are we still not in need for a strong united front?....and no political party, in my opinion, can truly say that they are 'for the poor' or 'for the rich'....last time I checked, politicians salaries are a whole lot more than mine and they don't have to worry about paying their bills, their car insurances or where they are going to live in the next 6 months because they can't afford anything...
Don't get my wrong....I love America and the political process....I have even considered a career in politics....but, I wish Americans would take a look at the issues when they vote instead of who is more popular or what party they have been in....I am a registered Republican, but if there is a Democrat, Independent or Right to Life candidate that is more qualified and I believe will do an excellent job, I will not hesitate to vote for them...sometimes you have to put aside your personal issues with people and do what is best for the country in the long run.
I hope I have not offended anyone....but as I said this is my opinion and everyone is entitled to their own opinion...it is after all AMERICA!!
Goldi1021
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by marymoon Shallow is judging someone on looks, clothing or their fave coldstone flavor.
I like birthday cake.
SomethingBlu
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by Goldi1021
Posted by marymoon Shallow is judging someone on looks, clothing or their fave coldstone flavor.
I like birthday cake.
I've never had Coldstone...
Blu-ize
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by Xelindrya
Posted by Blu-ize
Pirro is a b*tch. I've had a personal experience with her.
uhm so have i. sorry you feel so uhmm 'strongly'
Politics aside.. I find her inspiring. We asked her to speak at our last major insurance event and she was moving, riveting and impressive.
I personally think Hillary is a winner only because of her name not for what she's done. She's a two faced liar who lives on the waves of 'misquotes' when it suits her and rages on 'misunderstood comments' when they aren't to her advantage.
Hillary winning at ALL is going to be a horrid shame.. but so was her winning in the beginning but she knew that when she came here.
Oh well... I vote and I put in my opinion.. that's the best I can do. *shrug*
I can imagine she was a good speaker and she is very comfortable in front of people. She practically ruined a family to get a win...she lost anyway, but she was just out for the win. I spent weeks with her while being examined and cross examined.
eogara
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by marymoon But if you're saying that my gay friends are cauing tghe breakdown of the family, then we may have a problem.
Agreed - 100%. However, I don't think that you can... actually, strike that - I KNOW that you can't determine someone's feelings on that based on what party they're registered as. What former anit-bride (sorry, can't rmember the new SN off the top of my head) said was that when she found out that someone she had know for some time, whom she admired and respected, was a Republican, she couldn't look at her the same way again. I think that is a terrible way to handle relationships.
Just proves what I've always believed - best way to prove to a 'liberal' that they're not so liberal? Come up with a dissenting view and see how accepting they are of it.
eogara
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by takeoutcook
Posted by eogara
Posted by takeoutcook
and yes, Bill Clinton, a politician, lied - They ALL do, regardless of party.
They don't all break the law with their lies. He lied under oath about using his power as President of the United States to gain sexual favors from one of his interns.
That's not disturbing to you??
As far as 'it didn't lead us to war' - nope, it lead us to September 11th. While Clinton got laid, Osama played. Just something to keep in mind the next time you want to compare presidents
I'm sorry - but what in my one line quote said all that?
Yes Bill Clinton lied under oath. I never said I wasn't disturbed by it. He cheated on his wife - as did Kennedy, as did Jefferson, as did Hoover, etc. I dont excuse that behavior.
I also never said that his lie never led us to war. . . I'm really not sure what in my post you're referring to.
I also did not compare presidents. . . I just pointed out that politicians lie. I don't believe I took any side - republican or democrat.
re: 9/11 - while a lot of Clinton haters would like to blame 9/11 on his behavior, and a lot of Bush haters would like to blame 9/11 on him, I dont believe you can blame that horrendous event on one president - it was years in the planning and was the result of years of hating American foreign policy.
Ahh, just realized I hadn't requoted SomethingBlu's comments - that's what the war stuff was referring to. Sorry - I was trying not to post a bunch of times in a row by consolidating it into one post but apparently that didn't work.
eogara
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by PrincessRose Just thought I'd post this excerpt from an article for you: 'When asked about president Clinton's performance on defense the only criticism Paul Wolfowitz had was Bill Clinton's obsession with Osama bin Laden. Clinton's plan to eliminate al Qaeda root and branch was completed only weeks before the inauguration of George W. Bush. Clinton's National Security Advisor Sandy Berger arranged ten briefings for his successor, Condoleezza Rice, and her deputy, Stephen Hadley. He told Dr. Rice, 'I believe that the Bush administration will spend more time on terrorism in general, and on al Qaeda specifically, than any other subject.'''
And I don't think he used his power as president to get sexual favors from an intern. He's a relatively good looking guy, and extraordinarily charismatic. Monica was probably into him anyway.
Finally, I don't think that there is anything more important in this country than Freedom. Freedom of Religion, Freedom of Expression, Freedom of Speech. Benjamin Franklin said 'He who gives up liberty for security deserves neither.' And I think that these things are a lot more important than my pocketbook, which I'll add has been signifcantly fuller under democrats than it ever was under a republican president.
Personally though, I think that our government's strength and true justice (as opposed to displaced vengeance) are a lot more important than whether or not I can afford a coach bag.
Ok... first thing's first. Clinton-Osama... While I respect Mr. Wolfowitz's opinion on Clinton's fixation on bin Laden, I still believe the cuts in defense made during his presidency, as well as the time he spent preparing for his impeachment trial (because, realistically, he is only human - you have to save your own as$ before you can worry about everyone else's) were factors in bin Laden and his cronies planning and preparing for the attacks. We had I believe 2 agents at that time who spoke 1 dialect each out of the tens of dialects in the area al Qaeda is known to exist. That, to me, is a MAJOR problem. I could go on but I know I'm not going to convince you and you're not going to convince me so I'll just stop here.
As for the coach bag statement, I have to say I kind of resent it. What I said was you have to be alive and have a job. I said nothing about anything relating to luxuries or creature comforts - I was referring to being able to put food on the table and have a bed to tuck your kids into at night. You cannot expect someone who is starving to concern themselves with rights like free speech, et al. I agree these are wonderful and important things, but if you see 1/2 a meal a day, it's somehow not at the top of your list. That's what I was referring to.
palebride
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
Just proves what I've always believed - best way to prove to a 'liberal' that they're not so liberal? Come up with a dissenting view and see how accepting they are of it.
I like that!!!
dpli
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by JPC1125
Posted by eogara
Posted by JPC1125 I now look as people who I thought I liked and am left wondering ' how can you honestly think like that?'
Kind of shallow to have someone's political views change your entire opinion of them, no?
I didnt see this as shallow...I think its very realistic to find yourself conflicted that someone you thought you knew does not share your same views. This is why I stay away from political and religious talk at work. When I found out a teacher at work is wife to one of our state senators who is Replublican, I couldnt look at her the same way for some reason. Knowing that she supports things that I don't made me think of her differently. I didnt want to but I feel that our beliefs are core to who we are.
I disagree. I don't equate political beliefs with a person's core values. I think most of us would like there to be better schools for our kids, safer neighborhoods, more jobs for those who are unemployed, better opportunities for people in general. I think political views and beliefs are more about how to get there. I have very dear friends who disagree on many topics with me politically, but I know that they are decent, responsible, ethical and hard-working people who are true friends. I do sometimes wonder how they can think so differently than I do, but respect their right to do so.
I also think that having friends with different political views who are willing to discuss them rationally can introduce me to new ideas and challenge me in a different way than the friends I always agree with.
Just out of curiosity, if you believe that you see people differently when they don't agree with you, why not talk about some of those things sooner, rather than later? Wouldn't it be more disappointing to find out later, after you become closer to the person?
marymoon
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Re: More Politics Pirro vs. Clinton is it even a contest?
Posted by eogara
Posted by marymoon But if you're saying that my gay friends are cauing tghe breakdown of the family, then we may have a problem.
Agreed - 100%. However, I don't think that you can... actually, strike that - I KNOW that you can't determine someone's feelings on that based on what party they're registered as. What former anit-bride (sorry, can't rmember the new SN off the top of my head) said was that when she found out that someone she had know for some time, whom she admired and respected, was a Republican, she couldn't look at her the same way again. I think that is a terrible way to handle relationships.
Just proves what I've always believed - best way to prove to a 'liberal' that they're not so liberal? Come up with a dissenting view and see how accepting they are of it.
There's so muhc interparty dissent that it's so polarized, and people for some reason assume that b/c you're support one party or the other. It' flawed. My mother supports republicans only because she's pro-life, but she disagrees with the republican stance on almost everything else. Being a Republican doesn't mean you're a bible belt neo conservative, just like ebing a deocrat doesn't mean you're a pinko bleeding heart liberal. I don't think there's anyone who agrees with their party 100%, which is part of why the 2 aprty system is so flawed and how it's led so many people to feel uneccesarily marginalized. People feel like there's no room for them in politics because they don't folow either party, or they feel thos great sense of 'otherness' about the other party. The red state, blue state mentality. I'm really very far left with my views, but most people aren't and so I wish there could be room for middle ground. I'm actually a registered republican, as I mentioned on the other thread (aort of long story) , but that doesn;t stop me from being a tree-hugging pinko...LOL
Also, it's like people mentioned financial and other issues vs. political issues. I honestly don't care if my friends think social security is a good idea or how high the teax rate should be, but I do care if they are compassionate people, and if they support human rights, etc.
