MY last new topic of the week... Ethical Dilemna about my Bachelor Party

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Posted by june262004


ETA: Hearz I got an extra one for u.

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A) strip clubs are fun (its not just a guy thing)
B) no matter what it will all work out and you'll have fun - strip club or not
C) Im against the whole 'letting' issue but then again, I don't care if Jim goes to a strip club, but that's not my marriage we're talking about, not much you can do about it

Relax and fun and stop worrying!

I'll probably get flamed for this as well..But here goes..

I think you should plan the bachelor party as YOU want it, and let this guy deal with his master..If he takes his balls out of her purse and decides to go, great, if not then maybe you can do something else with him at a different time. I dont think a husband and wife should tell each other what they can and cant do, they are adults and can make thier own decisions. I wouldnt care if my man went to a strip club for a bachelor party, if he went every weekend or something, then that would be a different story.

If a woman is so controlling over a man that she feels the need to *forbid* him to do something, he may do it out of spite. A man that has the trust of his s.o. would probably feel guilty doing anything when he has a great girl at home that trusts him. Its like if you keep accusing a man of cheating over and over and he really isnt, he may just go out and do it because you think he is anyway..I know that doesnt sound logical, but I have heard that from many guys, and I guess to the male brain (some of them at least) it does.

The men at a bachelor party probably have a better chance of 'getting some' while barhopping at a regular bar or club than at a strip club. Think about it..A group of fun guys out having a good time could easily meet a group of girls also looking to have a good time.

No matter where your man goes..a strip club, a bar, whatever..temptation is everywhere..If he has no intention of cheating, no matter how drunk he is, or how cute that girl he met on line at the store, he won't. End of story.

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Posted by suven

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Posted by OctGroom

Yet.. it my bachelor party.. and does she have the right to tell us in essence what we ALL can and cannot do. We want to feel like we have the option to do it if we want to.

Opinions.....

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Oh dear. You're going to hate me for saying this, but...

You are REALLY over-analyzing what you think that she might think...

And, they are married. It's really not your business what they 'discuss' (argue about)

I am sure that your friend realized how she felt about strip clubs before he married her. This is obviously something that he has already discussed and resolved with her.

SO, if you want to go, then go. But, I don't think it's right for you to be pissed at your friend's wife because your friend won't go. And, don't pass 'the blame' off on her. Your friend can make his own decisions. And, it sounds like he made his own decision when he decided to marry her...

My own side bar here: I ended my last serious relationship because of strip clubs (sometimes the guys DO get to do more than just look)...

So, as soon as I started dating my now husband, I was VERY clear about the fact that I am completely against them. He had no problem with that (he 'got it out of his system' when he was younger).

For his own bachelor party, HE didn't want strippers around. OF COURSE, as soon as he said, 'no strippers' EVERYONE assumed that it was because of ME. In reality, we never even discussed it. He just never wanted stippers, so there was no need for discussion...

And, he has said that he would skip any bachelor parties with strippers because he's just not into that (and, apparently he always used to get 'harrassed' by the strippers)

all I have to say is, don't blame this chick. She is not trying to control YOU...and, I am sure that she and her husband have discussed and resolved this issue a long time ago. don't be the one who gets in between them...

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Now you are gonna hate me for this...

Are you kidding me? Seriously.

How am I over-analying what she might think?
I am trying to be sensitive enough not to cause a fight between my friend and his wife.
He wants to go.. but his wife says no. Obviously.. NOT resolved between them.
Obviously.. it effects me since it is my party.
How is it not her 'fault'?

Frankly, my friend should take his credit card and buy some courage and put his woman in her place. A man goes and does what he wants.. when he wants.. and he does nothing that he cannot look her in the face and tell her that he did. That's a man. IMO

Now I cannot stand women (or men) who cannot trust their own mate or think that they will fall into a horizontal tango with the first good-looking stranger they see.

These are my personal favorite type of people to laugh at -- the type of people who lose sleep at nights, worried if their SO found someone else to sleep with because they are out with a group of friends.

Now are some guys might fall into this trap but there is a lot larger number of good guys who wouldn't. A good woman trusts her man and doesn't try to control where he goes, unless there's a reason she needs him to do something that she needs or wants. A good man does nothing that would disgrace himself or his wife. (And vice versa with all this.)

And for anyone else for says a strip club is immature or dumb.. you know what..

Maybe us men consider a weekly shopping spree for clothes/shoes dumb.. so if you want to throw stones at us, I got an army of 'em.

Now if I was a woman.. I would be all for sending my hubby to a strip club for a bachelor party. (Obviously if he went 5 nights a week.. there's a problem.) And the reason I would send him is because I know I could trust him and not live in fear of him straying.

And any guy who says it's out of his system.. is a liar. It's never fully out if he was once into it. there's always time for a Golden Oldie. Let his buddies work on him for 20 minutes.

But then again.. some guys who rather have peace than to do what they want to do. And I won't throw stones too much at that concept. There's some validity to it.

However in the end.. if it's all about rules and fear.. and if it's not about trust and love.. that's pretty damn sad. IMHO.

I don't know...

I still think your overanalyzing this. It's not up to you to try to be sensitive to what a married couple might fight about.

I say, if you want to go, then go. But, if your friend doesn't go, it's HIS decision (unless the wife puts a gun to his head and makes him stay home)

It's not necessary that she thinks he's gonna actually sleep with/touch anyone. She just might not feel comfortable with the whole strip club scenario. Maybe she feels like it's disrespectful to her, or whatever other reason she's not supportive of it. Maybe she feel that having her man/husband checking out other naked women IS disgraceful to her. Or, maybe they're just broke or saving up for something and she doesn't want him dropping chunks of cash here and there. I don't know. It's really not my business what her deal is.

And, how do you know what you'd feel if you were a woman?

You really don't know that it's about rules and fear. Until this chick TELLS what her beef is, you'll never really know.

Best of luck! And, whoever had the idea to do dinner first and then go to the club had a GREAT idea! Then, you would get everything you want. Plan you day as YOU want. But, don't get upset if other people can't come or leave early, or whatever. Just like you shouldn't get in the middle of their arguments, they have no right to tell you what to do.

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Posted by suven

I don't know...

I still think your overanalyzing this. It's not up to you to try to be sensitive to what a married couple might fight about.

I say, if you want to go, then go. But, if your friend doesn't go, it's HIS decision (unless the wife puts a gun to his head and makes him stay home)

It's not necessary that she thinks he's gonna actually sleep with/touch anyone. She just might not feel comfortable with the whole strip club scenario. Maybe she feels like it's disrespectful to her, or whatever other reason she's not supportive of it. Maybe she feel that having her man/husband checking out other naked women IS disgraceful to her. Or, maybe they're just broke or saving up for something and she doesn't want him dropping chunks of cash here and there. I don't know. It's really not my business what her deal is.

And, how do you know what you'd feel if you were a woman?

You really don't know that it's about rules and fear. Until this chick TELLS what her beef is, you'll never really know.

Best of luck! And, whoever had the idea to do dinner first and then go to the club had a GREAT idea! Then, you would get everything you want. Plan you day as YOU want. But, don't get upset if other people can't come or leave early, or whatever. Just like you shouldn't get in the middle of their arguments, they have no right to tell you what to do.

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I know we're on opposite sides of this and that's cool. (I've had much harsher debates with very close family members.)

I do understand your POV.

But here's the position.. that this puts me in --

1.) I know my friend and his wife will fight about this.. nothing sucks more than arguing with the FW/DW.

2.) I want my Best Man to be able to plan this with ALL the freedom in the world. There's no reason the guys can't be guys and have a night where we don't have to worry about restrictions. I can assure you -- there will be no behavior going on that would have to be kept a secret from her.

3.) This guy is someone I know since 1987. I want him there the WHOLE night. If the guys choose a strip club, I don;t want him to feel like he has to go home early.

That would toally suck.

My FW knows that I certainly will not be out to do anything except gawk like a geek that night.. LOL

The same goes for ALL my groomsmen.

Then again..

I don't find the need to go see strippers. I told the boys we could go to White Castle and a movie and I would be fine with that.

(I wanna be surprsied of course with a fun night.. but to be 100% honest, just seeing the guys is enough for me.)

If she has issues, that's not our problem.

And I just don't want him to go home and have to get an earful about it.

Maybe we should just go to AC and 'kidnap' him for the night!

I find this thread to be really disturbing. I cannot understand how, if this man is your friend, you would write things like this. He married this woman because he loves her. He knows that if he goes to a strip club it will really upset her and so he chooses not to. This is a real man - someone who loves his wife enough to not cause her unnecessary pain. If you were really his friend instead of planning to 'kidnap' him, you would understand.

Yes, I am a woman who is against the whole strip club thing. The thought of my DH looking at another woman in 'that' way makes me ill to my stomach. But, you know what, it makes him feel the same way too. So, if he were in the situation of your 'friend' he would attend your party but 'choose' not to attend the nudie bar events. Not because I 'forbid' him but, because (1) he doesn't want to upset me and (2) he really doesn't like the whole scene himself and (3) he wouldn't want me doing the same thing. But, his friends would understand this because they are, his FRIENDS.

I think you really need to think about this from that point of view.

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Posted by Annieb

I find this thread to be really disturbing. I cannot understand how, if this man is your friend, you would write things like this. He married this woman because he loves her. He knows that if he goes to a strip club it will really upset her and so he chooses not to. This is a real man - someone who loves his wife enough to not cause her unnecessary pain. If you were really his friend instead of planning to 'kidnap' him, you would understand.

Yes, I am a woman who is against the whole strip club thing. The thought of my DH looking at another woman in 'that' way makes me ill to my stomach. But, you know what, it makes him feel the same way too. So, if he were in the situation of your 'friend' he would attend your party but 'choose' not to attend the nudie bar events. Not because I 'forbid' him but, because (1) he doesn't want to upset me and (2) he really doesn't like the whole scene himself and (3) he wouldn't want me doing the same thing. But, his friends would understand this because they are, his FRIENDS.

I think you really need to think about this from that point of view.

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WRONG.. he wants to go. She said no.
Unnecessary pain?.. oh please....

BTW.. she's going to my FW's bachelorette party. If a male stripper runs out.. what is she going to do.. run away????

Maybe his wife should LEARN TO TRUST instead. Perhaps she would be a stronger person and better for it knowing that the sight of another female doesn't make him turn into a drooling piece of jelly.

Now let me say this.. I know her for a pretty good length of time. And she's a great person. She and I get along wonderfully.

But--

Why is it the because of her that the ten of us have to understand.. 'No.. we can't do that or this.. His wife will get angry'

The kidnap thing was merely tongue in cheek.
Did you not see the 'LOL' next to it?

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Posted by Annieb

I find this thread to be really disturbing. I cannot understand how, if this man is your friend, you would write things like this. He married this woman because he loves her. He knows that if he goes to a strip club it will really upset her and so he chooses not to. This is a real man - someone who loves his wife enough to not cause her unnecessary pain. If you were really his friend instead of planning to 'kidnap' him, you would understand...

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i'm with you . i don't like it and neither does my FH. if he did i wouldn't be interested in him. is he 'allowed' to go to these types of events? sure! would he/did he arrange something like this for himself? no. does he surround himself with people who do this? no. did they all do this years ago? yes. some more than others...

this is about giving a good group of friends the ability to go out and enjoy themselves without anyone having to feel guilty or having to worry about one of us going home and have to apologize for going out to have some innocent fun. And that's all there is to it.

now.. if anyone wants to judge me.. and my abilities --> as either a friend/ a future husband.. or even my morals.. I will gladly put my track record up against anyone else's.

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Posted by OctGroom

this is about giving a good group of friends the ability to go out and enjoy themselves without anyone having to feel guilty or having to worry about one of us going home and have to apologize for going out to have some innocent fun. And that's all there is to it.

now.. if anyone wants to judge me.. and my abilities --> as either a friend/ a future husband.. or even my morals.. I will gladly put my track record up against anyone else's.

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why so defensive?

do what you want and don't feel bad or annoyed about it! your friend has free will and if he wants to go he will be there, consequences and all... we all pick our battles, perhaps he doesn't want to fight this one?

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Posted by september2004

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Posted by OctGroom

this is about giving a good group of friends the ability to go out and enjoy themselves without anyone having to feel guilty or having to worry about one of us going home and have to apologize for going out to have some innocent fun. And that's all there is to it.

now.. if anyone wants to judge me.. and my abilities --> as either a friend/ a future husband.. or even my morals.. I will gladly put my track record up against anyone else's.

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why so defensive?

do what you want and don't feel bad or annoyed about it! your friend has free will and if he wants to go he will be there, consequences and all... we all pick our battles, perhaps he doesn't want to fight this one?

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the point is.. if one can lose someone so easily because of this, they ain't sure worth it.

Maybe my friend doesn't want the battle. But you can't live in fear of your SO. And your SO has to know that you're not going to stray just because you went to a strip club for a Bach p.

Like I said before, if there was a male stripper at my FW party, would she run away from the party? I wonder how much of a two way street this is? Hmmmm.......

None of my business.. I know that already.

i'm with you 100% my friend.

If I was your friend, I'd go, and take the consequences.

But, I repeat, it's YOUR night. I wouldn't feel guilty. Invite him and if he chooses not to go, then that's the cross he bears and the decision he makes.

Then, take him out separately and double date with the wives.

And she's going to your FW's bachelorette party??????

That's nerve

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Posted by don424

i'm with you 100% my friend.

If I was your friend, I'd go, and take the consequences.

But, I repeat, it's YOUR night. I wouldn't feel guilty. Invite him and if he chooses not to go, then that's the cross he bears and the decision he makes.

Then, take him out separately and double date with the wives.

And she's going to your FW's bachelorette party??????

That's nerve

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Thanks Buddie!

Look, I don't want to make her into a villian.

She's really a great girl and she and my friend have an open invite 24/7.

She's been invited to my FW bachelorette party. I hope she goes. My FW likes her a lot.

For whatever reason, she just doesn't let my friend out of her sight.. LOL It REALLY irritates his brother. They took a trip to Las Vegas and according to his brother.. she just kept calling and calling. It's like.. 'Chill out.'

He's not going to cheat. Period.

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Posted by june262004

...If you can't let ure S.O. go to a strip club or out with friends. I think you should reevaluate your relationship and rethink getting married.

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Not looking to start trouble, but just wanted to share from my vault of knowledge .. guys who I know .. who 'never would do such a thing' .. did at their bachelor parties .. I've heard too many tales .. I find it really disturbing .. and this by no means is to suggest that there aren't gals who have done the same at their bachelorette parties .. I'm just saying .. sometimes it's not always about trusting in someone.

Referring to bachelor/bachelorette parties as the 'last night of freedom' .. that troubles me.

So, call me whatever you want .. but .. I've known guys who were the type you'd absolutely without question believe as the 'never would' .. and did.

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Posted by Kel

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Posted by june262004

...If you can't let ure S.O. go to a strip club or out with friends. I think you should reevaluate your relationship and rethink getting married.

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Not looking to start trouble, but just wanted to share from my vault of knowledge .. guys who I know .. who 'never would do such a thing' .. did at their bachelor parties .. I've heard too many tales .. I find it really disturbing .. and this by no means is to suggest that there aren't gals who have done the same at their bachelorette parties .. I'm just saying .. sometimes it's not always about trusting in someone.

Referring to bachelor/bachelorette parties as the 'last night of freedom' .. that troubles me.

So, call me whatever you want .. but .. I've known guys who were the type you'd absolutely without question believe as the 'never would' .. and did.

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oh ye of little faith......
i have no response...

I have known many of those guys as well. I know guys who have gone to bachelor parties and told their girlfriends that they wouldn't do anything, then lied to their gf and said nothing happened and have told me what they did.

When you start drinking you start doing things that don't seem like a big deal. It happens. Many people are guilty of it. So you promise your S.O. that you wont get a lap dance. All of a sudden you have 3 or 4 drinks, you get a little loose, tons of guys are getting them, you decide hey one lap dance isn't so bad. Now you've broken your promise. Cheating? Possibly not depending on the relationship you're in. But nevertheless you broke a promise.

And I don't mean you OctGroom. I'm just saying 'you' in general. And of course it happens with woman too. I'm not at all pointing out the guys. I know plenty of girls who have done questionable things when out at a bachelorette party.

But I do feel that in a relationship there has to be trust and you just have to trust your S.O. that they wouldn't do something. If you're going to spend the rest of your life with someone that you doubt you're never going to be entirely happy.

i'm with you man

no comment

they don't get it and i'm not causing any controversy

hey, I don't even think as far as the lap dance. It just makes me feel nauseous to picture my husband gawking at naked women.

ANYWAY,

I was thinking about this some more.

Playing devil's advocate here...

WHAT IF your friend was a recovering alcoholic? Would you be upset with his wife because she wouldn't want him going out to a bar with you?

WHAT IF he was a recovering gambler? Would you be upset with his wife because she wouldn't want him going to AC with you?

Let me whip out my old, dusty psychology degree here...

Could it be that you are really upset at your FRIEND because he won't 'choose you' and go to the strip club with you? But, instead of admitting that you're upset with him for not going out with you, you're validating why he 'can't' come and getting upset with the wife instead?

(When all's said and done, I still think you should plan your night as you want it, but don't get upset with anyone else over it! )