Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

---

Posted by verdila

---

Posted by heidla

Well, I first have to say that 4 months is a lot longer then I have spent in any war. I would think that 4 months during war probably feels just as horrible as four months in hell. I think to trivialize over the amount of time someone spent in a war is alittle misguided.

I think that it was actually made a part of his campign for several reasons.

1. The war we are fighting in Iraq has been said to be the 'next Vietnam'.

2. The current President did not serve in Vietnam and it is questioned as to where he actually was during this period.

3. Kerry's service was going to come into question because he came home and protested the war.

4. I think it is also an issue because people right now want a strong leader and Kerry's service helps bolster( or is meant to) his image in that way.

It was not an issue in Dole's campaign because the country was not at war. It was also not made an issue by the other team beacause Clinton never served at all.

---

I am not misguided at all - I know 4 mos is alot more than some people served, but I just find it a little funny that they are making this huge deal out of it when it was over 30 yrs ago - not to mention that he did come back from war and pretty much neglected his fellow soldiers there when he got to Senate.... in his democratic convention speech he flip flops all over the place - saying he will be tougher on terrorism than Bush, but then in the same breath, he will not bring us to an unjustified war, bla, bla. I think he is capitalizing on his 4 month service in war but its sort of funny because there are alot of Vietnam vets who dont like him at all for what he did 30 yrs ago - alot of that is true....look at his record.

Just because we werent in war at the time doesnt mean that Dole didnt need to bring to his campaign the fact that he was a WW2 war hero - he just didnt want to capitalize on it like Kerry is doing.

4. I think it is also an issue because people right now want a strong leader and Kerry's service helps bolster( or is meant to) his image in that way.

OK - he served 4 mos and got 3 purple hearts that he CONSTANTLY refers to (one for getting shot in the *** I think) and then came back and led the country against the war in Vietnam, pretty much making the war what it became here at home, a f'ng mess - thats the kind of man you want to lead our troops? Interesting.

I am not a Bush lover either but I think that both of these candidates are liars and its like choosing the lesser of two evils. Obviously, on LI weddings there are more Kerry supporters so anybody who challenges him is going to say they are misguided or what not, but I am just trying to present another side of the coin. Not to mention that if Kerry is elected, stock market is goign to tank again and taxes will get higher. He is also in favor or bringing back the marriage penalty tax.

Like I said, I am just trying to present another point of view than the prevailing one on LIW.

more food for thought:

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.asp?ID=5468

And for some people concerned with their livelihoods - small businesses. This is very true: (one of my family members is a small bus owner and is very scared at what will happen to his business if Kerry gets elected)

Kerry tax record for small business:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1135193/posts

---

Kerry served five months in from what I have heard described as Hell. He saw things and did things that I can not imagine and then came home and spoke out about the atrocities. Yes, that will make alot of people not like you. Nobody is arguing that everyone that served in the Military with him liked him, but most that actually served under him appreciate his leadership and support his actions after he came home. I appreciate that he had the guts to come home and speak out about his experience knowing that it was not going to make him popular with everyone else.

I think that you can be tougher on terrorism and not lead our troops into an war. If Bush really wanted to be tougher on Terrorism by sending our troops to war then he could have at least sent them to a country that we know harbors terrorists. He could have finished what was started in Afghanistan. Or better yet, he could allocate more money for homeland security to those cities that are obviously at a higher risk. Why is it that people in Iowa get more Homeland Security Funds then the people of New York? DC? LA?

I know politicians lie. I always go to the polls feeling as if I am choosing the person that I think will screw things up the least. I don't think that everyone who supports Bush is misguided. I said that I think that when people trivialize the amount of time that a man put his life on the line for his country is misguided. One day is more then most of us have spent (myasmom excluded) . I also come from a family with a long history in the military and so I get defensive.

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

Read my other post abut how one of the veterans who backed these attakcs i nt renouncing them

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

There is a commercial put out about this.

I hope the link still works cause J Kerry was trying his darndest to get it banned from TV

www.swiftvets.com

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

Well I think that you will see some who take back what they say about Kerry and those who do not. From reading the comments that Marymoon posted sounds like remorse of somesort perhaps realizing that that vet does not want to be in the hotseat for speaking against one of his own..kinda like Kerry ironically.

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

I think criticizing John Kerry for protesting the war and saying he 'turned his back' on anyone is ludicrous. NO ONE with half a brain is going to tell you that the Vietnam 'police action' was a good idea. NO ONE. If they do, I really just can't imagine that they're sane or smart or have all of the facts. Aside from the thousands who were killed in Vietnam, I personally KNOW people whose lives have been destroyed by it. Cousins who now have a disability, or who literally went crazy, who have serious problems from agent orange, etc. This is excluding all of the damage and abuse brought upon the vietnamese people. Everyone's entitled to his or her opinion, but to me, nothing it more clear than the fact that it was a big mistake and a stain on our nations's history.

In NO way does this mean that anyone who served during that time was bad or need be criticizeed (unless they personally did something bad). They went there, whehter voluntarily or not, and they did their best to serve and protect our nation. They were brave and honorable, even if the mission was not.

Even if you diagree and think Vietnam was fine and dandy, I don't think it's fair to cirticize someoen who went to war voluntarily, participated in it, and cma ehome and had the openness of mind to declare that it was not so hot. Even though he only spent 4 months there, 4 months in 'hell' is a long time. ANd for those of you who have been on active duty or have loved ones or spouses who have, you know how long 4 months can be. It's about 3 months and 29 days longer than I'd survive in a compat situation, I can tell you that much.

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

Interesting persepective from a Vietnam vet...

Oh No! Vietnam Again? Shame On Us All...
----------
Most Americans wonder why we're wasting time debating John Kerry's military record from 35-years ago. In this dangerous time when the U.S. faces an enormous challenge in responding to a new world, comparable to that we faced post-World War II, we should instead be seriously debating the future and what is best to do now.

I am a Marine Vietnam veteran, with a 4-year old son who is my life. I hugged him and cried on 9/11, and worry daily what the world will be that he enters. Who will lead him, and to what purpose, and at what costs? That is what we should be considering in this presidential year.

Senators Dole and McCain, who endured enormous suffering in previous wars, appeal to put the past behind us. So, why does Kerry's old record elicit such passions?

Unfortunately, while almost all Vietnam vets put Vietnam behind us, went on to build our lives, and are not activists, John Kerry chose to make his time in service the centerpiece of his campaign. Most Americans think this is a trivial issue. It's as if John Kerry's relatively minor credentials as a junior officer for a short time in Vietnam combat are all he can point to as his credentials for leading the most powerful nation on earth in the current challenges. No one should deny the valor of this service. But, is that what the American people and the citizens of the world should be focused on for the man who will significantly affect our lives and the lives of our children? John Kerry chose to create this election battlefield. So, he must answer for it, and be willing to face the music he wrote about himself.

Thirty-three years ago, I organized the Vietnam Veterans for a Just Peace in reaction to Kerry's organization Vietnam Veterans Against the War. John O'Neill and others joined me, and with the support of tens of thousands of Vietnam veterans, we rebutted Kerry's charges that we were all war criminals. Literally, no one was defending us, many Americans were discouraged by the charges, and we young Vietnam veterans were suffering horribly from discrimination in our efforts to get on with our lives.

Thirty-three years later, the surprise emergence of John Kerry as candidate and his centerpiecing of his Vietnam service stirred many Vietnam veterans to reclaim the image and honor that Kerry besmirched. We knew better. John Kerry continued the past 33-years to consistently misrepresent his activities and the calumny he brought upon us. That led to an enormous groundswell among now middle-aged Vietnam veterans, emerging from every walk of non-political life that we had individually built, to set the record straight.

It is well documented that most of the claims made by Kerry and his Vietnam Veterans Against the War were fraudulent, none of his anti-war vets were willing to provide evidence, and many of the Vietnam Veterans Against the War members had not served in Vietnam. We now know that the true leadership of the vets against was extreme radicals, directed by a Vietnam vet impersonator. Yet, John Kerry has never apologized. Youthful excess and zeal is one thing. Mature hypocrisy is another.

But, clinching the need for our public stand for the Kerry truth is his deceptive pride in it, fouling the perception of us among a new generation of citizens, maybe my son, that enrages so many of us. In April 2001, Kerry wrote that, 'We returned home to an America that was indifferent, even hostile. There were no parades, only nightmares. Veterans were spat upon, called baby-killers…' Yet, he continues to not apologize for his leading role in creating just that hostile atmosphere or exploiting it now. Indeed, in a disturbing pattern, only in March 2004 after exposure by those who served with him did Kerry's current National Coordinator of Veterans for John Kerry admit that his own published charge of atrocities is false.

We are not Republican stooges, as Kerry accuses any who oppose him. The proportion of Democrat vets is similar to the general population. We are simply pissed off and, once again, we are forced to stand up for ourselves, by ourselves, and yearn to fade back into our hard-built peaceful lives. We merely ask that America demand honesty of John Kerry, honest consideration of who has really demonstrated the public integrity to lead us, and hope for meaningful debate over our challenging future. Getting the staged uniforms out of his campaign commercials immediately would be the first critical step. Shame on us all Americans if we do not unite to demand this.


----------
Bruce N. Kesler
Sergeant, USMC
Vietnam 1969-70
Founder, Vietnam Veterans for a Just Peace

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

I just want to say that I have tremendous respect for people who go to war and defend our freedoms for this great country. I dont have children, but I would be terrified if my son or daughter were fighting right now. In my family, my father served in the National Guard for 5 yrs and my grandfather was a decorated hero in WW2 fighting against his parent's (my great grandparents on my fathers side emigrated here) own country of Italy.

However, as the last post pointed out - it was Kerry's idea to make his relatively short time in Vietnam (and I believe he was drafted) the centerpiece of his campaign so he should take responsibilty for the actions and decisions he made when he returned home from that war over 30 yrs ago.

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

I don't think he's making it the centr fo his campaighn because it's his only credential. It's clearly to show theamericna people that he can handle a country in war and crisis. The campaigning is really for stupid people, who look to speeches and other BS for who to vote for. These are the people who don't even know what the candidates stand for, except for what comes through on TV. Unfortunately, that's most of America. i think he's just playing to his audience. Peopole are very concerned for their safety, and he needs to assure people that he can make them safe. people are criticizing John kerry, saying he can't lead the nation's army, but he can certainly do it better than someone who never even served. That's what i think the campaign perspective is.

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

marymoon...i think you always have a lot of great things to say and have many valid points but i just think you need to stop calling those people you dont agree with stupid...i have notice you do it a lot when it comes to politics. Just because someone doesnt agree with you it doesnt mean they are stupid

Re: something I think you should read about john kerry--LONG

---

Posted by marymoon

I don't think he's making it the centr fo his campaighn because it's his only credential. It's clearly to show theamericna people that he can handle a country in war and crisis. The campaigning is really for stupid people, who look to speeches and other BS for who to vote for. These are the people who don't even know what the candidates stand for, except for what comes through on TV. Unfortunately, that's most of America. i think he's just playing to his audience. Peopole are very concerned for their safety, and he needs to assure people that he can make them safe. people are criticizing John kerry, saying he can't lead the nation's army, but he can certainly do it better than someone who never even served. That's what i think the campaign perspective is.

---

But that's just it - many people ARE questioning his ability to be the commander of our armed forces because of the actions he took following his time served in the war. It was the things he did at home that people have problems with, not the time he served in Vietnam.

It's obvious he is using his experience as a war VET to illustrate that he will be tougher on terrorism. But will he be tougher? Or will Kerry decide that this is not a war worth fighting and accuse our veterans of war crimes and create the kind of environment that was created during Vietnam where we pretty much abandoned our veterans upon their return home. Of course, if he is elected, I hope he does make us feel safer in this crazy world. I am on the fence as to how Kerry will be because of the actions he took following his service. Do I feel safe with Bush...? No. But I dont think I will ever feel completely safe again.

On a side note, as someone else pointed out about homeland security funds, I believe it was Kerry and/or some democrats who voted to take away money from NYC and give it to Iowa.

And one more thing - are you saying that most of America is stupid? That is a pretty shallow statement.